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Unread 2013-08-27, 08:33 AM   #1
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Default Uncontrollable boost

I recently put a MBC and Dualport Wastegate in my car. After I had the MBC dialed in for 15 PSI everything worked great. On my way to St. Joe I broke down because a boost tube blew off. I re-tightened it down and went on my way. On my way home from St. Joe I was in 3rd and 4th gear and noticed my boost was going way above 15 PSI. I turned the MBC down, but the boost was still too high. I have pulled vacuum on my wastegate and as well as applied pressurized air to it. It passes both test. Doesn't leak at all. I took off the wastegate dump pipe. It appears my wastegate opens, but possibly not all the way. Would the wastegate not opening its full travel cause higher than normal boost?
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Unread 2013-08-27, 08:42 AM   #2
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Yes, if the gate cannot open as it should, you'll get boost creep as it cannot bleed off enough pressure. It seems suspect that you'd be boost creeping immediately after blowing off a pressure pipe. You sure there wasn't any vacuum tubes attached to that pressure pipe or anywhere else on the pressure side that might have blown off, caused a vacuum leak which is bleeding pressure to the MBC?
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Unread 2013-08-27, 12:28 PM   #3
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I took the boost signal line directly from the source to the top port of the dual port gate. So that should allow it to open on spring pressure. It still was overboosting. It take out the MBC as a variable.

I don't know if the boost creeping happened right after that boost pipe blew off. It was a few hours in between the time that blew off and we left St. Joe.
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Unread 2013-08-27, 12:31 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Billy Mild View Post
I took the boost signal line directly from the source to the top port of the dual port gate. So that should allow it to open on spring pressure. It still was overboosting. It take out the MBC as a variable.

I don't know if the boost creeping happened right after that boost pipe blew off. It was a few hours in between the time that blew off and we left St. Joe.
If you disconnect the flapper gate from the wastegate arm, are you able to open the gate freely? Or is it welded on?
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Unread 2013-08-27, 01:56 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Billy Mild View Post
I recently put a MBC and Dualport Wastegate in my car. After I had the MBC dialed in for 15 PSI everything worked great. On my way to St. Joe I broke down because a boost tube blew off. I re-tightened it down and went on my way. On my way home from St. Joe I was in 3rd and 4th gear and noticed my boost was going way above 15 PSI. I turned the MBC down, but the boost was still too high. I have pulled vacuum on my wastegate and as well as applied pressurized air to it. It passes both test. Doesn't leak at all. I took off the wastegate dump pipe. It appears my wastegate opens, but possibly not all the way. Would the wastegate not opening its full travel cause higher than normal boost?
Is it possible hen dialing in your mbc that you had a boost leak and had to have the controller set really high and now that you got your boost tube back on and tight there is no more leak. You could try lowering the controller more or like you said remove it for now. Just a thought as I've not worked on a mbc sense I had my 87 conquest tsi rofl.
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Unread 2013-08-29, 07:46 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by redline2.3dizi View Post
Is it possible hen dialing in your mbc that you had a boost leak and had to have the controller set really high and now that you got your boost tube back on and tight there is no more leak. You could try lowering the controller more or like you said remove it for now. Just a thought as I've not worked on a mbc sense I had my 87 conquest tsi rofl.
I tuned the MBC as low as it goes with no change in how the boost was reacting. I decided to remove it altogether and connect the boost signal line directly to the wastegate with no change. If I unplug it completely the boost spikes really fast.
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Unread 2013-08-31, 10:20 AM   #7
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Did you figure out your issue? Can you adjust the wg at all?
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Unread 2013-08-31, 06:53 PM   #8
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I tuned the MBC as low as it goes with no change in how the boost was reacting. I decided to remove it altogether and connect the boost signal line directly to the wastegate with no change. If I unplug it completely the boost spikes really fast.
If this is true, the WGA, or Flapper is incorrectly functioning. It could be an entire host of issues, including but certainly not limited to:

Flapper obstructed: Take Down pipe off, feed 10-20psi to the WGA directly from an outside air source and observe the operations.

Flapper pivot bearing rusted or sticky: Use Kroil (Google it) to soak the pivot and free the flapper operation. I use this in place of PBblaster with much better results - Kroil will work it's way uphill.

WGA operation: This can be tricky - you need to find out what the sweep distance of the arm is at maximum extension. I always remove the actuator, and clamp it in a vice, then using moderate force I will pull the arm keeping it square, and measure the distance.

Once I have the physical distance - I'll hook the air rig up to it and feed it PSI via a range - I use an airbrush regulator for the low psi's - 1-9, and a normal for 10-20

Measure the distance when its Air actuated - if it's more than 5-10% less than the mechanical distance the diaphragm inside is ripped and you need a new WGA.

I've done this several times on several different internal WGA's.
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Unread 2013-09-03, 09:27 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by redline2.3dizi View Post
Did you figure out your issue? Can you adjust the wg at all?
In a short answer no I haven't found the issue.

I took the wastegate completely out of the car and the valve opens without issue. I did a little test and made a video. It is almost fully open at 15 PSI.

Something went wrong. Please make sure you added the video correctly.

Video URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZD2Db09iT0

While the wastegate is in the car you can hear the valve snap shut when pressure is released so the valve still opens with the wastegate dump pipe installed. Today was a little different.

Well I put it all together and made sure there weren't any exhaust leaks.

I re ran the boost line from the intercooler pipe to the T connector. After everything was hooked up I tested. I made sure pressure was being sent to both sides of the T. I had air movement at the MBC inside the car, and at the wastegate. I hooked the MBC up and made sure the MBC when turned down all the way didn't let any air out. It passed. I then turned then knob up and air was coming out the other end of the MBC.

I went for a test drive unfortunately nothing really changed. Boost in 4th gear goes up to 15 psi up until about 4,000 rpm when it will continue to go up to 17,18,19 psi. Thats when I let off. I tried setting the MBC and the result is about the same. Turned all the way down or turned up a little bit same result.

Cliffs:
Same results. 4th gear up til about 4000 rpm I get 15 psi but after that it starts to build boost again. Yikes.

I'm stumped and out of ideas. The wastegate seems to work fine, the MBC will allow air to pass through it.
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Unread 2013-09-04, 12:53 AM   #10
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Nice. Bicycle tire pumper to build pressure.

Anywho looks like an aftermarket wg?

The top port isn't used unless you have a ebc in most cases. You use the lower port.

Without knowing the setup that's just weird. You stated having problems after you switched to this aftermarket setup?
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Unread 2013-09-04, 08:41 AM   #11
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Nice. Bicycle tire pumper to build pressure.

Anywho looks like an aftermarket wg?

The top port isn't used unless you have a ebc in most cases. You use the lower port.

Without knowing the setup that's just weird. You stated having problems after you switched to this aftermarket setup?
Hey you make due with what you got.

http://www.lindseyracing.com/LR/Part...STEGATEDP.html

http://www.lindseyracing.com/LR/Parts/TECHMBC.html

It is kind of aftermarket. It is a modified stock unit built by Lindsey Racing. The top port is the boost signal and the side port is used to increase pressure of the spring. Should have a .7 or .8 bar spring in it.

My stock wastegate failed(valve stuck wide open) letting my car not build boost. At first I threw this wastegate in along with an MBC. I ran 10 PSI for a few weeks and the car ran great. After that I decided to put my chip in for higher boost 15 PSI. I tuned the MBC and made quite a few runs to make sure it was setup properly. Would hit 15 PSI and stay rock steady. Something changed after my ride up to St. Joe I noticed that boost was spiking way past 15 PSI. Lower gears are fine, but higher gears it was uncontrollable.
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Unread 2013-09-11, 08:31 PM   #12
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So have you hooked wastegate back up like normal, got on it hard to see if boost creep happens in standard form?
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Unread 2013-09-13, 10:10 AM   #13
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what spring is in the wastegate? could it be a >15psi spring?
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