Mirror Finish Polishing ~ 1-816-529-6089 ~ sales@mirrorfinishpolishing.com ~ mirrorfinishpolishing.com For the best rate on home, auto, life or business/commercial insurance call me at 888-959-0955, cell 636-734-1310 or bricehazelwood@weiss-ins.com. Never Done Garage - donewhenimdead.com Peerless Automotive Reconditioning - 1155 W. Dennis Ave, Olathe Ks, 66061 - 913-893-1201 Mark H. Epstein ~ The Epstein Law Firm, LLC ~ 913-396-5123 Wilkes Automotive ~ wilkesautomotive.com ~ 246 Marion St, Olathe, KS 66061 ~ 913-254-7171 Skandalous Inc ~ www.skandalousinc.com DIY Auto Repair Inc ~ www.diyautorepairkc.com ~ 11509 Strangline Rd, Olathe KS 66062 ~ 913-226-3806 Your advertisement here! The Law Offices of Jeremiah Johnson, LLC ~ 104 E. Poplar, Olathe, KS 66061 ~ (913)764-5010 ~ www.kcatty.com - www.johnsoncountydui.com ~ jeremiah@kcatty.com Santa Fe Body, Inc ~ 8717 Lenexa Drive, Overland Park, KS 66214 ~ (913) 894-6090 House of Boost LLC Nude? HouseofHID.com - The #1 source for HID The Print Shop KC 816.200.6694 or Ryan@RMD-Photography.com the art of tyleR ~ http://tyleR.bigcartel.com ~ TYLERcoey.com ~ MUTTtoy.com ~ MUTTtoy@gmail.com W-K Chevrolet Buick Pontiac Cadillac GMC ~ 3310 W. Broadway, Sedalia, MO 65301 ~ 800-382-5088 ~ Cell 660-553-8928 ~ dustin@wkchevy.com ~ www.wkchevy.com

Go Back   KCSR - THE Kansas City Forum > General Forums > (Almost) Anything Goes

Reply
Thread Tools
Unread 2017-12-14, 03:01 PM   #1
84USNGT
 
84USNGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 4,627
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 47
Thanks (Received): 184
Likes (Given): 949
Likes (Received): 931
Dislikes (Given): 4
Dislikes (Received): 23
Default Net Neutrality

Is there anyone, or even several people here who could please explain what this topic is all about, its ramifications and how it effects me as an individual consumer?

I have heard all types of dire predictions and warnings from naysayers and prophets of doom on the internet, but have yet to wrap my head around what they are talking about. Besides worst case scenarios and "what if" situations, no one article or individual has helped me to understand what is, or was, or will be at stake.

If someone has even a brief bit of time to explain the idea and changes in this concept to a relative Luddite, I would appreciate it. Thanks!
__________________
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
84USNGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 03:07 PM   #2
JDLM
Schutzstaffel
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lenexa
Posts: 163,075
Post Thanks / Like
Default

Net Neutrality simplified



Something went wrong. Please make sure you added the video correctly.

Video URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG2NbLt-ziA

Something went wrong. Please make sure you added the video correctly.

Video URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p90McT24Z6w
__________________

AW|E90|ZSP|ZPP|2XA|NAV|HID| ///M | BMS |JB4 | VRSF



Post Thanks / Like - 0 Thanks, 1 Likes, 0 Dislikes
Likes 84USNGT liked this post
JDLM is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 03:13 PM   #3
Ricerking13
 
Ricerking13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 50,910
Post Thanks / Like
Default

My opinion is not popular on most message boards/reddit/etc.

My understanding, is net neutrality at it's most basic point... is that all internet traffic should be equal. Netflix shouldn't get faster speeds from your ISP (Time Warner, Cox, Verizon, etc) than say Hulu. They should get treated equally.

Up until 2015, we didn't really have any major issues with the above happening (some examples exist, but it's an outlier not the norm). Obama placed internet speeds (oversimplifying here) to be regulated by the FCC like other utilities (phone, electric, water, etc).

Since the FCC now oversees the internet speeds... the ISP's will be easier to control, and stop any future issues where they start modifying speeds. The change went into effect in 2017, which effectively lead to very little change occurring, which was the intent. Detractors from Obama's action point out, it was never going to occur... and supporters think it's great because now it "can't occur".

PS: This is an incredibly simplified example, and is my view of the situation.
__________________
2015 Genesis Coupe Ultimate
Ricerking13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 03:33 PM   #4
84USNGT
 
84USNGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 4,627
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 47
Thanks (Received): 184
Likes (Given): 949
Likes (Received): 931
Dislikes (Given): 4
Dislikes (Received): 23
Default

So do we "have" Net Neutrality now or is its neutrality being threatened in some way if we do have it?
__________________
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
84USNGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 03:50 PM   #5
Ricerking13
 
Ricerking13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 50,910
Post Thanks / Like
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 84USNGT View Post
So do we "have" Net Neutrality now or is its neutrality being threatened in some way if we do have it?
Even though I don't agree with much of the popular opinion... I would agree our "neutrality" is always in danger. I think it was with the previous rules in place as well though.

The primary issue I take with the NN crowd, is that we should be focused on monopolistic ISP's far more than the current NN topic. Without the insanity that is our monopolies, the fear of the NN crowd becomes almost a non-issue.
__________________
2015 Genesis Coupe Ultimate
Ricerking13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:00 PM   #6
JDLM
Schutzstaffel
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lenexa
Posts: 163,075
Post Thanks / Like
Default

__________________

AW|E90|ZSP|ZPP|2XA|NAV|HID| ///M | BMS |JB4 | VRSF



Post Thanks / Like - 0 Thanks, 2 Likes, 0 Dislikes
Likes 84USNGT, Keboh liked this post
JDLM is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:00 PM   #7
Keboh
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Overland Park
Posts: 13,861
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 213
Thanks (Received): 254
Likes (Given): 2537
Likes (Received): 1703
Dislikes (Given): 24
Dislikes (Received): 47
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 84USNGT View Post
So do we "have" Net Neutrality now or is its neutrality being threatened in some way if we do have it?
Net Neutrality was put in place in the Obama Admin. Republicans just voted to repeal it, today. Net Neutrality is now gone.

This allows:
Internet to be sold in 'packages' like cable, rather than simply you getting a specific speed/data cap with access to any web page. It's now possible for ISPs to say "you get Google and Yahoo and Hotmail with basic. You wanna watch Netflix? You need to pay more to get the 'streaming sites' package, or you simply can't hit that website. It also allows for throttling of webpages, basically in the same fashion.

Also, with companies like AT&T owning CNN or Verizon owning Yahoo, it should be frightening. AT&T is now allowed to have control over the content and news that you get with cost... AT&T could say "you get access to CNN with basic. You want Fox News? You need to pay extra".

It also threatens entrepreneurship, for the above issues.
Keboh is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:02 PM   #8
JDLM
Schutzstaffel
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lenexa
Posts: 163,075
Post Thanks / Like
Default

__________________

AW|E90|ZSP|ZPP|2XA|NAV|HID| ///M | BMS |JB4 | VRSF



JDLM is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:11 PM   #9
Scooby24
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Olathe
Posts: 51,822
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 50
Thanks (Received): 696
Likes (Given): 361
Likes (Received): 3992
Dislikes (Given): 27
Dislikes (Received): 40
Default

It's simple and I don't see how ANYONE can be for the repeal.

Websites, apps can now be treated like channels you have to subscribe to you they absolutely will.

I am streaming all my TV now. You think these ISPs that offer internet and cable are cool with you getting rid of cable because you're now using streaming providers from their competitors like DirectTV Now?

Fuck no. They'll shut that shit down. That's not doom and gloom, that's just what's going to happen. Fuck the FCC and the Trump admin for this.
__________________
-Greg
'18 Forester XT Touring
Post Thanks / Like - 0 Thanks, 1 Likes, 0 Dislikes
Likes JewelsMari liked this post
Scooby24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:16 PM   #10
Keboh
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Overland Park
Posts: 13,861
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 213
Thanks (Received): 254
Likes (Given): 2537
Likes (Received): 1703
Dislikes (Given): 24
Dislikes (Received): 47
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooby24 View Post
It's simple and I don't see how ANYONE can be for the repeal.

Websites, apps can now be treated like channels you have to subscribe to you they absolutely will.

I am streaming all my TV now. You think these ISPs that offer internet and cable are cool with you getting rid of cable because you're now using streaming providers from their competitors like DirectTV Now?

Fuck no. They'll shut that shit down. That's not doom and gloom, that's just what's going to happen. Fuck the FCC and the Trump admin for this.
Yeah, I was pretty not cool with Republicans wanting to fuck the poor for benefits themselves, or remove healthcare provisions, or gerrymandering districts to skew the vote, or racist comments, or simply denying facts and science, or fully and vocally endorsing an alleged child molester...

but legitimately, they just fucked with my internet. That's it, zero respect for that party. At this point, I full on refuse to even entertain the notion about why someone believes in that party. Fuck them, just so fucking hard.
Keboh is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:26 PM   #11
Ricerking13
 
Ricerking13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 50,910
Post Thanks / Like
Default

Government rules/regs helped create our lack of an open market of ISP's.

Yet you guys want more "government protection" for the problem governments have created.



Your internet is the same as it was in 2016 Keboh... same as last year. If the ISP's do fucked up shit... that can be dealt with... that's how society works. I get in a worst case scenario there could be bad things happen... I also get that government has royally fucked up our internet ALREADY... I'm not in the camp that wants more of that shit.
__________________
2015 Genesis Coupe Ultimate
Ricerking13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:29 PM   #12
Scooby24
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Olathe
Posts: 51,822
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 50
Thanks (Received): 696
Likes (Given): 361
Likes (Received): 3992
Dislikes (Given): 27
Dislikes (Received): 40
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricerking13 View Post
Government rules/regs helped create our lack of an open market of ISP's.

Yet you guys want more "government protection" for the problem governments have created.



Your internet is the same as it was in 2016 Keboh... same as last year. If the ISP's do fucked up shit... that can be dealt with... that's how society works. I get in a worst case scenario there could be bad things happen... I also get that government has royally fucked up our internet ALREADY... I'm not in the camp that wants more of that shit.
Do you have information on how these government rules and regulations stifled the current ISP market place and how benefiting current/future ISPs is more beneficial than protecting content developers and the public at large?
__________________
-Greg
'18 Forester XT Touring
Scooby24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:30 PM   #13
MountainDew
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 18,745
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 282
Thanks (Received): 173
Likes (Given): 387
Likes (Received): 810
Dislikes (Given): 344
Dislikes (Received): 90
Default

I've pirated over 700gb of movies and tv shows in the last two weeks. Last time I heavily torrented anything was like 2013 or 2014. I'll be damned if I have to pay for streaming services AND additional fees to access them. I'll just cancel everything.
__________________
2005 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VIII
MountainDew is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:32 PM   #14
MountainDew
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 18,745
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 282
Thanks (Received): 173
Likes (Given): 387
Likes (Received): 810
Dislikes (Given): 344
Dislikes (Received): 90
Default

The only potentially good thing about Net Neutrality is that more cities will vote on municipal internet. The city of Longmont, CO has municipal internet. Gigabit speeds for like $30 or $40 a month and they've already came out and said no changes would be made because of NN.
__________________
2005 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VIII
MountainDew is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 04:43 PM   #15
Keboh
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Overland Park
Posts: 13,861
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 213
Thanks (Received): 254
Likes (Given): 2537
Likes (Received): 1703
Dislikes (Given): 24
Dislikes (Received): 47
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricerking13 View Post
Government rules/regs helped create our lack of an open market of ISP's.

Yet you guys want more "government protection" for the problem governments have created.



Your internet is the same as it was in 2016 Keboh... same as last year. If the ISP's do fucked up shit... that can be dealt with... that's how society works. I get in a worst case scenario there could be bad things happen... I also get that government has royally fucked up our internet ALREADY... I'm not in the camp that wants more of that shit.
This fight didn't start in 2016, dude. It has been a battle for over a decade, about how to classify ISPs, through the many shades of shady things that ISPs have tried to pull on users. Net Neutrality was a HUGE win that prevented ISPs from regularly attempting to pull shit on users.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FCC_Op...net_Order_2010

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_ne..._United_States

Repealing the Title II status, ISPs no longer have to abide by the standards set forth in 2005. Not 2016.

It's a really big deal. Don't down play it based on your ignorance on the topic.

What has the government done to royally fuck up our internet already, that you're referring to? (besides maybe not do anything about allowing a handful of companies to completely dominate the vast majority of ISP options and monopolize swaths of the country)?

Last edited by Keboh; 2017-12-14 at 04:49 PM..
Keboh is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 05:06 PM   #16
Ricerking13
 
Ricerking13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 50,910
Post Thanks / Like
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooby24 View Post
Do you have information on how these government rules and regulations stifled the current ISP market place and how benefiting current/future ISPs is more beneficial than protecting content developers and the public at large?
I genuinely don't understand the question. I do have info on how government regs stifled the ISP market. I don't get how that connects to the second part of your response?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keboh View Post
This fight didn't start in 2016, dude. It has been a battle for over a decade, about how to classify ISPs, through the many shades of shady things that ISPs have tried to pull on users. Net Neutrality was a HUGE win that prevented ISPs from regularly attempting to pull shit on users.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FCC_Op...net_Order_2010

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_ne..._United_States

Repealing the Title II status, ISPs no longer have to abide by the standards set forth in 2005. Not 2016.

It's a really big deal. Don't down play it based on your ignorance on the topic.

What has the government done to royally fuck up our internet already, that you're referring to? (besides maybe not do anything about allowing a handful of companies to completely dominate the vast majority of ISP options and monopolize swaths of the country)?
I mean I bolded the part that I believe is the biggest fault of government. Instead of encouraging competition, stopping massive mergers, and breaking up monopolies... we've all been asking for the FCC to ask these massive monopolies to not fuck us over past a certain degree. That's a pretty terrible tactic, IMO.
__________________
2015 Genesis Coupe Ultimate
Ricerking13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 05:11 PM   #17
Scooby24
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Olathe
Posts: 51,822
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 50
Thanks (Received): 696
Likes (Given): 361
Likes (Received): 3992
Dislikes (Given): 27
Dislikes (Received): 40
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricerking13 View Post
I genuinely don't understand the question. I do have info on how government regs stifled the ISP market. I don't get how that connects to the second part of your response?
Well if you're arguing that the overturned title II rules were stifling the ISPs, but were CLEARLY and I mean VERY CLEARLY providing protections for content providers and the public alike, you must be arguing that the stifling of the ISPs past, present and future are of greater concern than the protections in place for content providers and the public.

Were you making more generic arguments with government regulation in general?
__________________
-Greg
'18 Forester XT Touring
Scooby24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 05:25 PM   #18
Ricerking13
 
Ricerking13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 50,910
Post Thanks / Like
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooby24 View Post
Well if you're arguing that the overturned title II rules were stifling the ISPs, but were CLEARLY and I mean VERY CLEARLY providing protections for content providers and the public alike, you must be arguing that the stifling of the ISPs past, present and future are of greater concern than the protections in place for content providers and the public.

Were you making more generic arguments with government regulation in general?
Yep generic I think is the issue. I'm not saying that Title II was currently stifling ISP's, though it certainly could under a different admin.

The government has failed us massively in the internet arena... I think more government using PART of 80yr old rules designed for a different concept altogether, and saying they won't use the entirety of those rules (they pinky promise) isn't good for business, competition, and our eventual success as citizens... thinking its a good thing for us seems to be forgetting how horrible our government does at almost everything.
__________________
2015 Genesis Coupe Ultimate
Ricerking13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 05:31 PM   #19
Keboh
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Overland Park
Posts: 13,861
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 213
Thanks (Received): 254
Likes (Given): 2537
Likes (Received): 1703
Dislikes (Given): 24
Dislikes (Received): 47
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricerking13 View Post
I mean I bolded the part that I believe is the biggest fault of government. Instead of encouraging competition, stopping massive mergers, and breaking up monopolies... we've all been asking for the FCC to ask these massive monopolies to not fuck us over past a certain degree. That's a pretty terrible tactic, IMO.
I don't get it. You said "Government rules/regs helped create our lack of an open market of ISP's."

It's the LACK of rules and regs that created the lack of ISP options. The government was hands-off, allowing the monopolies. That isn't an over-regulation issue, it's an under-regulation issue..

So yes. We want more fucking rules and regulations. Not for Net Neutrality to get repealed, not for Government to be hand-off allowing monopolies.
Keboh is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 05:38 PM   #20
Ricerking13
 
Ricerking13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 50,910
Post Thanks / Like
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keboh View Post
I don't get it. You said "Government rules/regs helped create our lack of an open market of ISP's."

It's the LACK of rules and regs that created the lack of ISP options. The government was hands-off, allowing the monopolies. That isn't an over-regulation issue, it's an under-regulation issue..

So yes. We want more fucking rules and regulations. Not for Net Neutrality to get repealed, not for Government to be hand-off allowing monopolies.
Municipal governments have slowed and stopped new ISP's from forming/installing. Google FIber is a good example of how well it can go, IF the muni will get out of the way.

Agreed with we need regulations about breaking up monopolies... this is FAR more important than the unlikely realization of your ISP blocking websites you like due to being greedy.

If we had the focus of the community on the right issue, which is breaking up monopolies and encouraging new ISP growth... we wouldn't have to even worry about current NN concerns. The primary reason this isn't an issue in the UK, is plenty of competition. We're instead focused on limiting these massive company's ability to fuck us for a profit... instead of letting the market grow and eliminating any chance of that happening.
__________________
2015 Genesis Coupe Ultimate
Ricerking13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 05:57 PM   #21
Scooby24
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Olathe
Posts: 51,822
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 50
Thanks (Received): 696
Likes (Given): 361
Likes (Received): 3992
Dislikes (Given): 27
Dislikes (Received): 40
Default

Monopolies are an issue. Title II has nothing to do with it.

New ISP growth is entirely unrelated to Title II as I understand which is why I asked for examples...and I really want examples of exactly how what was repealed today was impeding ISP growth.

Your belief that these concerns for blocking or throttling content is unlikely is grossly naive. These companies have been trying to do this for years. Verizon was trying to block our ability to use our devices to provide the same data we paid for to hot spot other devices. They were even pressuring google to block third party apps from the play store for verizon customers. The FCC came in and was able to rule against them because of these regulations.

This isn't an obscure example and it's an immediate concern now. This shit IS going to happen.

Your generic arguments for unrelated needs to the overturning of Title II are pointless here. These shit is far too important to be muddying the waters.
__________________
-Greg
'18 Forester XT Touring
Scooby24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 06:02 PM   #22
DIYAutoRepair
**Sponsor**
 
DIYAutoRepair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,237
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 25
Thanks (Received): 194
Likes (Given): 71
Likes (Received): 1340
Dislikes (Given): 1
Dislikes (Received): 25
Default

I can see were ISP's would want to sell packages like cable but I also don't like the governments hand in all of that. The government could limit content that it doesn't approve of if they have control.

The best solution is what Ricer says, is for municipalities to open up the existing infrastructure so there is more competition. Municipalities are part of the problem, they all want their percentage of the money.
__________________
DIY Auto Repair
Fully equipped service bay rental by the hour
We also offer full service automotive repairs along with paint and bodywork
Visit us at http://diyautorepairkc.com/
or call (913) 226-3806

Favorite car from the past (73 Pinto)
DIYAutoRepair is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 10:11 PM   #23
Karlen
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Manhattan
Posts: 32,552
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 887
Thanks (Received): 482
Likes (Given): 4078
Likes (Received): 4371
Dislikes (Given): 99
Dislikes (Received): 169
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricerking13 View Post
Municipal governments have slowed and stopped new ISP's from forming/installing. Google FIber is a good example of how well it can go, IF the muni will get out of the way.

Agreed with we need regulations about breaking up monopolies... this is FAR more important than the unlikely realization of your ISP blocking websites you like due to being greedy.

If we had the focus of the community on the right issue, which is breaking up monopolies and encouraging new ISP growth... we wouldn't have to even worry about current NN concerns. The primary reason this isn't an issue in the UK, is plenty of competition. We're instead focused on limiting these massive company's ability to fuck us for a profit... instead of letting the market grow and eliminating any chance of that happening.
You dense mother fucker.

You do realize that Google has been forcing other ISP's hands in lowering their prices in the markets they move into, right? And that the other ISP's have fucking sued the cities to block Google's expansion in those cities?

On top of that, ISP's are suing cities to block them from forming their own services for their citizens.

Verizon, AT&T, Comcast, Time Warner/Spectrum - are supporting the repeal to fuck you, and every other internet consumer and you're somehow supporting that. Blows my fucking mind. All gubbment regulation bad, hurr durr.

Congrats, you're on the same boat as resident dumbfuck DIY.
Karlen is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 11:20 PM   #24
LTe
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Kehlsteinhaus
Posts: 2,207
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 105
Thanks (Received): 59
Likes (Given): 829
Likes (Received): 296
Dislikes (Given): 24
Dislikes (Received): 10
Default

I’m a republican and this honestly just blows. I just have no words on how stupid this whole thing is as it’s utterly ridiculous.
LTe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2017-12-14, 11:34 PM   #25
Karlen
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Manhattan
Posts: 32,552
Post Thanks / Like
Thanks (Given): 887
Thanks (Received): 482
Likes (Given): 4078
Likes (Received): 4371
Dislikes (Given): 99
Dislikes (Received): 169
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LTe View Post
Iím a republican and this honestly just blows. I just have no words on how stupid this whole thing is as itís utterly ridiculous.
Man, wait until you hear about the pedophile your party supported. Oh, and the serial sexual assaulter in chief.
Karlen is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

 

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:46 PM.


Design By: Miner Skinz.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.13.37
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright (c) 1993-2012, KCSR.org