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Unread 2017-01-11, 11:01 PM   #51
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Looks promising. Too bad about all the chrome, that terrible side grill/vent, the silly FAKE hood vents, and the cheesy KIA grill. If it didn't have that crap, it would be a far better looking car. My guess is $45-55K and German-like resale LOL.
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Unread 2017-01-11, 11:08 PM   #52
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The KIA "tigernose" has been a staple since Peter took over KIA he mentioned the brand needed an identity the same with a lot of car companies I think by now people would be used to it.

I think the hood vents as well as the sides are functional pieces (hood has silver mesh) the sides looks like a similar vent
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Unread 2017-01-11, 11:35 PM   #53
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The Stinger GT is a “Different Level of Kia,” Says High-Performance Development Chief




47 Photos

Albert Biermann on the Kia Stinger GT's Dynamic Capabilities


Motor Trend was invited to Korea for an exclusive preview of the new 2018 Kia Stinger. While we were there, we took a close look at the rear-drive sporty sedan and met with several executives. Motor Trend was the only U.S. automotive media outlet invited. We had the opportunity to chat with Albert Biermann, executive vice president and head of vehicle test and high-performance development for Hyundai Motor Group, after his presentation on the Stinger’s dynamic capabilities. Biermann was hired away from BMW in April of 2015, where he was vice president of engineering for BMW M Automobiles and BMW Individual.

Motor Trend: In your presentation, you said the BMW 4 Series Gran Coupe is the chief competitor. You had Audi A5 Sportback, as well?

Albert Biermann: Yeah, but we didn’t spend so much time with Audi.


MT: What would you say is the main selling point versus the 4 Series Gran Coupe?

AB: Styling aside?
MT: Yes.

AB: My car would be the [Stinger] GT. The 3.3 [liter twin-turbocharged V-6 engine] has this nicely balanced power. We can still deliver a good, let’s say comfort level in the car, but a really good level of power that is nicely balanced and controlled. It’s a huge car, but the way it drives … I mean, you get the opportunity soon … so it’s a very enjoyable car.





MT: What was your first reaction to seeing the car when you got here?
AB: This one I didn’t see before, but before I joined Hyundai Motor Group, I had a chance to visit the design studios, and I was impressed with the cars I saw, the styling models. I couldn’t believe these were Hyundais or Kias. At that time I think I didn’t see the Stinger, but then later I saw the design model in the design review; it was almost a kind of final confirmation. I was really deeply impressed, but then two months later they brought the GT. That really was the ultimate kick. I liked the GT so much when I saw the GT. It was sitting there in the nice red color and was really impressive, and I thought, “OK, that’s the car where we have to deliver a whole different driving experience.” This is a different level of Kia.
MT: You came into this project only a year and a half ago. How much was already set by then?
AB: The platform was the most basically defined. We have been working on the platform for a long time, like I just said. We were still improving some elastokinematic areas just a few months ago. There were many, but this is what we normally do. This was the first car of this new platform—it’s more like an evolution, not a revolution of the platform. Of course, this car gets a lot of attention and much fine-tuning. We change control arm positions, all kinds of kinematic variations, and the level of response and precision—that was a key job, to give the Stinger more driving precision than our other cars. They are clearly focused on a good level of isolation, and they have different architectures—front-wheel-drive cars—but with this one we could reach a nice balance point on a really higher level. Isolation is still very good even with the 19-inch summer tires from Michelin. The isolation level is really quite good—no road noise, harshness. We are pretty happy. We keep fine-tuning, but that is for Kia just a whole different story. I think we can really challenge the others out there.









MT: What platform is this based on?
AB: This is the kind of evolution of the Genesis. It’s that kind of platform, but it’s a different front axle, some changes on the rear axle, and then even you have more stiffness in the body-in-white structure.
MT: Was increasing stiffness a need you saw coming in, or was this predetermined?
AB: Like I said, the base structures of our cars are pretty good. I mean, in the process of doing the first high-performance car, we don’t need to add a whole bunch of reinforcement bars. I mean, I’ve done other high-performance cars before where it needed a whole bunch of reinforcement to bring the car to that level. Our base structure is pretty good, pretty competitive. We only added, compared to the previous platform, two struts underneath. That’s it because the concept of the engine bay design and the concept of the structure in the front include the bars anyway. It’s part of the concept. That is not an afterthought or something.

47 Photos
MT: Does the engine bay fit a V-8?
AB: [smiles] Oh, I couldn’t tell you. I never check.
MT: Really?
AB: No, I didn’t check. I’m very happy with the V-6. I think it nicely matches. The way you experience the engine in the Stinger is a lot different than you experience the same engine in the Genesis G90. It’s a whole different collaboration; character is a lot different. They’re very responsive.
MT: So your preference is the six-cylinder? Rear drive?
AB: Yeah, clearly. We are still in the process of making the all-wheel drive as much fun as the rear-wheel-drive car. We are not finished yet, but I think we can get damn close.
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Unread 2017-01-11, 11:38 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave B View Post
Looks promising. Too bad about all the chrome, that terrible side grill/vent, the silly FAKE hood vents, and the cheesy KIA grill. If it didn't have that crap, it would be a far better looking car. My guess is $45-55K and German-like resale LOL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDLM View Post
The KIA "tigernose" has been a staple since Peter took over KIA he mentioned the brand needed an identity the same with a lot of car companies I think by now people would be used to it.

I think the hood vents as well as the sides are functional pieces (hood has silver mesh) the sides looks like a similar vent

Side vents (are a functional piece)

Quote:
GG: This is a vent, but you can call it a breather, as well. The air goes in from the front. The problem is in aerodynamics; at high speed, you always had a lot of pressure inside the wheelhouse. The airflow is really dirty and unstable. This really helps just to push the curtain of air there and to suck it out in the back.
Speaking With Gregory Guillaume on the Design of Kia's New Rear-Drive Sedan


Before the Kia Stinger GT debuted at the 2017 Detroit auto show, Motor Trend was invited to Korea for an exclusive deep dive on the car, and meet with many key executives. Motor Trend was the only U.S. automotive media outlet invited. We talked with Gregory Guillaume, chief designer for Kia Motors Europe, who provided the initial design presentation on the Stinger.


50 Photos
Motor Trend: One of the first things you mentioned in your presentation was a castellated windshield—the notched cut line where the roof meets the top of the windshield. Is that strictly styling?
Gregory Guillaume: Pretty much. We had some hopes at the beginning to do something in the middle—you always have the inside mirror with the angle that comes forward—but we didn’t structurally ever manage to utilize that. It’s a way to really recognize the car. Peter [Schreyer] often tells me he is in a restaurant and just sees tops of cars passing by—just the roofs out of the window. He says, “Yeah, I always know when there’s a Kia passing by just because of that detail.”
[Editor’s note: This notched cut line is reflected at several other points elsewhere on the vehicle, including the upper portion of Kia’s tiger-nose signature grille, the rear bumper of the GT, and on the inside in the A/C vent rings.]



MT: How do you describe the three-piece chrome strip that goes from the A-pillar past the C-pillar? What is that? What’s the term for that?
GG: We don’t have a term, but it’s just an element that we have found at some point at time. Actually, the previous-generation Optima had a similar thing. It’s a good trick to visually bring the car down, especially on this car because of the rear-wheel-drive proportion. It’s really important that the cabin visually sits backward from the car. It really just pulls it back all the way to a point.
MT: Interesting. Speaking of the cabin, can you talk about the exterior dimensions and interior volume?
GG: We wanted a long rear overhang, but what was very important from the beginning was the long wheelbase. I always measure a space inside the car more horizontally than vertically. Maybe it’s because I’m not so tall, but I never think, “Do I really look up there? How much space do I have?” But when I’m sitting in a car, I notice if my knees are touching the seat in front; things like that, they bother me. That’s why we really cared from the beginning to have a very big hip-to-hip-point distance front to rear. It’s probably one of the biggest in the segment, and that’s why it looks, it feels spacious when you sit inside. It’s that distance from front driver to rear passenger that’s much greater.


MT: And what about that extended reflector strip at the back? Is that for European regulations?
GG: Actually, it’s in the U.S. that you need a reflector more than we do. The show car had it as a signature with the little round detail around it. We tried to keep as much as we could, basically, from the concept car. When you see the concept car together with the production car and how similar the look, all the design themes have made it, basically, into the production car.
MT: What’s your favorite feature on the car?
GG: If I show it to you now, you’re probably going to come back all the time—it’s the Coke bottle curves because they are so subtle. From the side, there’s nothing to be noticed, but if you move toward the back, then you notice how subtle it comes out in the rear. Once you know that, I’ve noticed the people always come back. When I’m finished talking to them, they always go back, and they just go like, “Yeah,” because it’s just so subtle. Once you know it, you want to come back and see it. There are lots of things that are interesting on the car, but that’s something I personally like.









MT: Looks great. Talk to me about the vent behind the front wheel. This is the first time I’ve heard it called a side curtain air breather.
GG: This is a vent, but you can call it a breather, as well. The air goes in from the front. The problem is in aerodynamics; at high speed, you always had a lot of pressure inside the wheelhouse. The airflow is really dirty and unstable. This really helps just to push the curtain of air there and to suck it out in the back.
MT: And the hood [aka bonnet], you used another term for it—
GG: Island type. You know it from sports cars, basically. Very often the shut line of the bonnet is just on the top of the bonnet. Normal production cars, the normal thing to do is to actually come up the headline far on the side. But, sports cars always have those island-type bonnets, and it’s something that you just instantly hook up to the sports car world.
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Unread 2017-01-31, 12:07 AM   #55
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Video URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y61aOHKUt44
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Unread 2017-02-05, 05:06 PM   #56
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12 Things You Didn’t Know About the 2018 Kia Stinger

Kia’s first-ever driver’s car features a lot of firsts for the Korean brand






While most of the buzz at the 2017 Detroit auto show centered on new versions hugely important consumer cars like the Toyota Camry and Honda Odyssey, the car we most wanted to drive right out of Cobo Center came from an unexpected brand – Kia. The 2018 Kia Stinger sedan is the Korean automaker’s first effort at a true performance car. Kia officials made it clear that the Stinger is more Gran Turismo than super sports sedan, but hopes are high that the Kia Stinger, which was tuned at the famed Nürburgring, will impress enthusiasts.
At the show, we walked around the 2018 Stinger with Kia Motors America’s VP of product planning, Orth Hedrick, and learned several interesting new details about the car, which will consist of the base Stinger powered by a 2.0-liter turbo with 255 horsepower and the Stinger GT, packing the brand’s twin-turbo 3.3-liter V-6 with 365 horsepower underhood.
“This is a first time we’ve had a car like this in the lineup, ever,” said the affable Hedrick. “So we’re super excited about this. It started with the original concept, the GT, from 2011, and the impetus of that, I won’t use the word genesis, the impetus on that was really a dream from the designer [Gregory Guillaume, Kia Europe’s chief designer], which is why we had him on stage presenting it.”
Here is what we learned from our time chatting with Hedrick:


1. The wheelbase informed a lot of Kia’s decision making with the car. “Its 114 inch wheelbase [114.4 to be precise] is longer than anything else in the markets that it’s up against. The A4, the A5, even the GS 350, so the benefit there was, you get a lot bigger backseat,” said Hedrick. “The tradeoff is, you can’t twist, turn, and move like a 3 Series, or the ATS. And that was a deliberate tradeoff. I think for us, it was important, really, to be true to what the concept of the vehicle was. It’s not to be a 3 Series, it’s to be a GT.”2. Out at the Nürburgring, the Stinger’s pro drivers were looking to communicate specific attributes to the engineers that are more in line with a GT car. “They were looking for specific things like high speed stability, being able to track a line, is it balanced when you go over a negative radius? Does the car kind of offset, and does it feel heavy? A lot of the work is actually done digitally, before the car was even put together,” said Hedrick.
3. Weight distribution was a key focus, as was the powertrain placement. “We were trying to get as much as possible, the center of gravity down low, and in the middle of the car so we get close to 50/50. So that drove decisions, for instance, they did a lot of work making sure the engine is as low as possible and towards the middle of the car as possible,” said Hedrick.
4. The Stinger is built on the same basic platform as its K900 stablemate, but with a key difference. The mid FR platform, it’s the modular platform we use it across the board for K900, our sisters [Hyundai/Genesis] it for their two big FR cars. But the front and dash, forward, the engine room box is completely different,” Hedrick said. “It’s a little bit smaller in the front, it’s a little bit lighter, so that helped with the weight distribution.”
5. No, the Stinger’s hood vents aren’t functional (surprise, they’re a design flourish), but there is some functional design at the front of the car. “There’s an air curtain [at the edge of each side of the lower fascia]. And what that does is, when air comes around it creates a turbulence, a low pressure area [around the front wheels]. This helps create a sheet and it breaks that low pressure, and it just helps the aerodynamics a little bit. It stops that turbulence that happens along the side of the car,” Hedrick said.
6. While the hood vents aren’t functional, there is a “floating hood” on the Stinger. “The other big discussion point was using, they call it an island hood, it’s the term that R&D groups call it, I think everybody else calls it a floating hood,” said Hedrick. “Typically, we have a cut line that goes across just behind the fascia, and it comes down over the fenders. A lot of other manufacturers use it but it’s expensive because you’ve got to get all of those parts coming together, and to make sure it’s flat and even all the way across. So this is the first application of that, and we wanted to give it that premium feel, that premium look.”
7. The interior of the 2018 Stinger carried over elements of the GT concept from 2011, and packaging and use of top tier materials were a major focus. “I think from an overall standpoint, this cockpit is pretty straightforward. We’ve got the three center vents in it. This was also from the original concept; they included a lot of the details on that. This has a shift by wire, which helped in some of that packaging when that transmission came through. The main thing is the backseat. But I think the other point is the premium materials. We didn’t have any really hard arguments with the bean counters, we were able to get pretty much everything we wanted,” Hedrick said.


8. The Stingers feature Brembo brakes at all four corners on both the base car and the Stinger GT, and they will roll on Michelin rubber. But there’s still a question whether they will be summer or all-season as the main option. “There’s only two other names except ours on the car, hence, on the tires and the brakes, so we wanted to make sure that we had top tier stuff,” said Hedrick. “These are specific tires, they’re different sized. We have two sets; we have an 18-inch, and a 19-inch. The 19s are available only on the V-6 twin turbo. And on the all-wheel drive, we’re gonna fit all of them with summer and we’re having a debate, we haven’t finalized yet whether to do all-seasons or summer.”
9. The Stinger’s hatchback-style trunk opening created some specific challenges the team had to address. There are other five doors out there, but if you’re going after handling, this is a huge engineering challenge, this big open space in the back of the body. So there was a lot of work that went into the body in white to make sure there was this stiff, rigid chassis that we needed,” said Hedrick. “This was really a trick because it’s right over the suspension point so you’re pushing all of the road inputs right where you have a giant hole. So the backend, if you watch it on the CAD it can really move around a lot. So there’s a giant ring of ultra, high-strength steel that goes around this opening, which is a really tough material to work with. It has to be molded while it’s molten, while it’s red hot. So they have to move this thing, and it’s all done with robotics to give it the proper shape.”


10. The concept also drove the decision to create the hatch-style trunk. We wanted to have something that was true to the concept which was two couples going down to a getaway weekend, a three day weekend, to make sure there’s enough room. If you look at the trunk on a 3 Series or an ATS, or premium sedans, it’s really small. And this, we thought, was kind of in line with the Kia practicality and the idea that you could use it as an everyday car and it’s really versatile, having this space back here means you can do a lot with it,” said Hedrick.
11. Roughly 130 meters of industrial strength adhesive is used throughout the car. “All of this was driven to get a really, really, super stiff, light body. It was not only for safety, it was also for that premium feel that we’re trying to build, that Germanic, European feel. But also just to give it a great handling, so the suspension can do its job,” said Hedrick.
12. The former head of BMW’s M division had a hand in the Stinger’s engineering. It’s a really cool looking car, and it’s going to drive as good as it looks because we’ve got Albert [Albert Biermann, BMW M’s former VP of engineering who left the company to become Hyundai’s head of vehicle test and high performance development in late 2014] involved with it from about halfway through development. And he’s pushing us really hard to make sure that it’s a great drive and also for our dealers to get them excited, because they’ve never had a driving car. So it’ll be interesting, it’ll be really interesting.
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Unread 2017-02-24, 11:23 AM   #57
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New Kia Stinger GT prototype review





20





We drive a prototype version of the new Kia Stinger GT and the first impressions are good

Verdict

There are still many questions to be asked of the Kia Stinger GT. We’ll have to wait until we drive the car on real roads, but on the strength of these prototype drives, there is good reason to believe that it could be a refined, fast and entertaining grand tourer to rival the best of them.



Kia has long been considered a high-value mainstream manufacturer that offered cheap, cheerful and well-equipped family cars. While a prolonged push upmarket has seen top-spec Sorento SUVs nudge £40,000, it’ll take a different tack later this year, with the introduction of its all-new Stinger GT halo car.
A four-door saloon targeting established German rivals such as the BMW 3 Series, Audi A4 and Mercedes C-Class, the GT will act as the Korean brand’s exclusive flagship when it arrives in UK dealers later this year. It’ll come with a choice of 2.0-litre petrol and 2.2-litre diesel engines, as well as a range-topping 3.3-litre V6.

Image 2 of 20

Image 2 of 20

For an early taste of the new Stinger GT, Kia allowed Auto Express behind the wheel of a development car for a handful of laps at its test track in Korea. While it was hardly enough for a definitive verdict, it gave us enough of a taster to form some key first impressions.



The seating position is good and the cabin spacious, with enough legroom in the rear even for taller adults. Interior quality is a step forward for Kia, too, although German competitors like the new A4 still lead the way.




The V6 engine feels strong and very responsive, although the soundtrack is a touch soulless and it doesn’t care to be revved much beyond 6,000rpm. The eight-speed auto is smooth, but the ZF unit that’s favoured by the likes of BMW and Jaguar is more responsive in manual mode. In a nod to the car’s grand touring remit, there is a fair amount of body roll in corners rather than the flat-bodied stance of a true sports saloon, but this doesn’t feel like a chassis that wants for control or precision.
The steering is direct, and there’s no looseness in the rack, plus what it lacks in feedback it makes up for with a predictable, intuitive rate of response at the front axle. Despite its size and weight, the Stinger GT feels agile and responsive in corners.
Image 10 of 20

Image 10 of 20

In addition to the time spent in Korea, Kia’s engineers also gave us a taste of the car in Arjeplog, Sweden, during their winter testing programme. Naturally, driving the car on a frozen lake didn’t tell us a great deal about how the car might behave on the road, but a second stint behind the wheel did confirm those first impressions of the sharp, direct steering and strong, responsive engine.



The low grip conditions allowed us to explore the car’s intriguing four-tier stability control system, however. Using the test facility’s 250-metre steering pad we started with the systems fully on, whereby all the little slips and slides that you feel on sheet ice are stamped out almost immediately.
Image 14 of 20

Image 14 of 20

By switching the car into sport mode, the electronic safety nets give a little more freedom, allowing you to enjoy the car’s playful rear-wheel drive balance without any risk of spinning. Tapping the ESC button once more triggers the ESC programme’s third stage. As in the previous mode the car will still nibble its brakes to keep itself under control to some degree, but it will no longer cut the throttle when the rear wheels spin excessively. That means you can hold long slides with some assistance, but if you overcook it the car will happily spin.
The final mode removes the safety nets entirely. There’s no ‘wake up’ function, either, so even if you spin or trigger the ABS violently the systems will remain fully off. In this mode it’s clear how effective the limited slip differential is, locking quickly and preventing the inside rear wheel from spinning away wastefully.



Quote:
Key specs

  • Model: Kia Stinger GT
  • Price: £43,000 (est)
  • Engine: 3.3-litre V6 twin-turbo petrol
  • Power/torque: 365bhp/510Nm
  • Transmission: Eight-speed auto, rear-wheel drive

  • 0-62mph: 5.1 seconds
  • Top speed: TBC
  • Economy/CO2: N/A
  • On sale: TBC



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Second Drive: 2018 Kia Stinger Thrills Despite Arctic Circle Chills










Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT

Three feet of lake ice supports a load of 110 tons, says the trusted Old Farmer’s Almanac, but the discomforting sound of the frozen surface cracking beneath my boots has me questioning the age-old reference book. A cursory glance over my shoulder reveals that I am standing at least a quarter of a mile from shore, and although the metallic red sedan next to me does many things impressively well, floating isn’t one of them. Regardless, I’ve traveled to an isolated frozen location about an hour's drive from the Arctic Circle in northern Sweden for one objective: dynamic testing of the all-new 2018 Kia Stinger.
It’s no secret that nearly all automakers test and develop vehicles in brutal environments all over the planet. Freezing temperatures, dangerous heat, and high altitudes push new cars and trucks to the limit. Yet, the spacious frozen lakes of the Scandinavia country offer something much more desirable than sub-zero climates — expansive areas of slipperiness.
Low friction surfaces are crucial for engineering and fine-tuning systems such as anti-lock brakes, electronic stability control, differentials and all-wheel drive systems as they represent the extreme side of the scale. Remote cities such as Arjeplog and Arvidsjaur fill their hotel beds with thousands of eager test engineers each winter. Recently, things were a bit different as they were joined by a dozen automotive journalists.
Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GTs on the ice.

Kia is launching its all-new Stinger sedan later this year. That timeframe indicates that the vehicle ― a turbocharged rear- or all-wheel drive five-door engineered to compete directly against the Audi A5 Sportback and BMW 4 Series Grand Coupe — is nearing the end of its development phase. There are still a few months left to dot the i's and cross the t's, which explains why the three vehicles parked on the lake in the frosty Northern European region are all prototypes. Two are covered with awkward zebra-striped decals and enough duct tape to rewrap a mummy, while a third appears emblazoned in red paint (upon closer examination, I notice that it’s really a vinyl wrap). The interiors are expectedly crude, and climbing on board requires lifting snow boots over duct tape and loose wires… but all of this doesn’t matter, as each is mechanically perfect.
On that note, there will be two Stinger models upon launch. The standard model (aka ‘Stinger’) will arrive with a turbocharged 2.0-liter four-cylinder rated at 252 horsepower and 260 pound-feet of torque. Those who prefer a nice jump in power will want the ‘Stinger GT’ that is fitted with a twin-turbocharged 3.3-liter V6 ‘Lambda’ engine, which boasts 365 horsepower and 376 pound-feet of torque — it’s more powerful than both Audi and BMW’s premium engine offerings.
Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT on the slolom

All models share the same 8-speed automatic transmission, but Kia will offer two drivelines: Rear-wheel drive (RWD) is standard, with all-wheel drive (AWD) an option. Both have been tuned with the enthusiast in mind — RWD models flaunt a mechanical limited-slip differential, while rear-biased AWD models are equipped with Dynamic Torque Vectoring Control. The suspension, which utilizes MacPherson struts up front and a five-link design in the rear, has been optimized for the company’s Dynamic Stability Damping Control (DSDC).
I’ve argued for years that building a sedan isn’t that difficult. Dozens of major automakers, and even a handful of kit companies, are engineering a chassis, mating it to a powertrain, and bolting four wheels on it. The true challenge — the minutia that separates the good from the bad — is found in the innumerable engineering hours spent fine tuning the chassis and subsystems to work as a cohesive team. This is called dynamic testing, and it’s where many fall far short.
As mentioned, ice is the perfect medium for testing, tuning, and tweaking, as the low friction surface reveals deficiencies that are masked when testing on high friction concrete or asphalt — note how much more of a challenge it is to balance your body when walking across slick ice? Now, image navigating a 3800-pound vehicle through a series of traffic cones, or attempting to hold a drift around a large circle, aided by a high-horsepower engine on the same slippery surface.


Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT

The Stinger GT, configured with AWD, is wearing proper winter tires. Even then, it requires a very delicate foot on the accelerator to move away from a standstill on a frozen lake. After navigating over the pseudo-roads (plowed areas on the ice), the nose of the Kia is facing a series of evenly spaced orange cones. Heavy machinery has groomed the expansive surface perfectly flat, leaving only minute grooves to capture wayward ice crystals — the tiny parallel lines offer little in terms of grip. I’m instructed to keep the speed below 30 mph… but I immediately recognize that’s a bit optimistic.
With electronic stability control (ESC) and traction control (TCS) enabled, I’m able to nudge the 365-horsepower sedan through the cones at just over 20 mph. Anything faster, and the electronic nannies remind me that their processing power is quicker than mine by cutting engine power and stabilizing the vehicle. Navigating the cones is effortless, and I can keep from running over the obstacles, but the going is not exactly exciting.
My passenger, a Kia engineer, asks me to try it again but this time with the drive mode set to ‘Sport.’ This alters the AWD system from sending a default 40 percent of engine torque forward, to just 20 percent — the rear wheels are doing the bulk of the propulsion. It also changes the algorithms for the ESC/TCS to allow more slip angle, or the ability to hang the tail out, which gives a (talented) driver more control. In Sport, there’s a bit of wag, but a gentle application of power tucks everything in nicely and I can swing it, like a pendulum, between the cones.
Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT

But wait, there’s more. Kia also has a two-mode ESC button. Press it quickly, and it enters a relaxed traction mode. Press and hold for several seconds, and ESC is turned completely off. (Most automakers are taking control away from the driver, yet Kia is offering fully defeatable stability control.)
The Stinger AWD exercise continues on a small skidpad, which is a grouping of cones that form a 25-foot circle in the middle of a large cleared area of ice. In default mode (‘Comfort’), with ESC/TCS on, the sedan circles with cautious confidence. Switch to Sport mode, and it’s three times as fun, fast, and challenging. After some practice, I can hold the drift about 180-degrees around the circle. The story is different when I defeat ESC, and the Stinger GT spins as if it’s a toy top.
Moments later, after switching into another Stinger GT, the real entertainment begins as I’m instructed to drive over to an extraordinarily massive skidpad that is more than a quarter-of-a-mile in diameter — nearly a mile in circumference — that Kia has plowed in the ice. This vehicle, a RWD model, has been fitted with studded winter tires that allow it enough grip to attain better than highway speeds on the skidpad.
Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT

In standard Comfort configuration it isn’t difficult to compel the Stinger GT into circling the enormous skidpad at a moderate speeds of about 25 mph. Steering inputs are met with an understandably sluggish reply as the tires fight for grip, but the sedan is responsive and easy to control. However, everything changes when Sport mode is selected and the invasive nannies are constrained.
Less invasive TCS requires light pressure on the accelerator to break inertia (anything more and the rear tires chew at the ice with little forward movement), but speed increases at a consistent level above a walking pace. Once the vehicle is going about 50 mph, a stab on the throttle breaks the rear wheels free and quick countersteer (keeping the front wheels parallel to the direct of travel) holds the slip angle. Drifting, or keeping a vehicle at a slip angle that doesn’t match the direction of travel, is a skill that requires careful harmonization between the steering and the throttle — if the steering isn’t precise, or the throttle lags or comes on with a rush, the drift is impossible to hold and the vehicle spins.


Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT

Put another way, a vehicle that has been properly configured dynamically is easy to drift. A vehicle that hasn’t been correctly engineered is nearly impossible to drift. Ice exaggerates the flaws, which is why engineers find themselves wearing heavy parkas more often than others.
A Stinger GT in Sport mode on a massive frozen skidpad is indisputably fun, but the real shenanigans begin when ESC/TCS is shut off. I nudge the Kia up to about 70 mph, which is blisteringly quick on a low-friction surface, and then initiate the drift. The sedan pitches sideways, with a glistening contrail of ice crystals following in its wake, as I methodically manage the controls.
Kia Motors

2018 Kia Stinger GT

My first few attempts at a high-speed drift reveal my heavy foot as the trunk swaps ends with the hood and the vehicle harmlessly pirouettes across the ice — soft walls of snow are hundreds of feet to the side (embarrassment, not a repair bill, is the largest concern). Yet after a moment or two of practice, and following the engineer’s advice to keep the transmission locked in fourth gear via manual mode, I’ve got the hang of it. I find myself with an ear-to-ear grin, traveling for 30 seconds or more sideways while throwing a rooster tail of shaved ice high into the air as the Stinger GT’s twin-turbocharged engine wails with delight.
The high speed on-ice exercise in the Kia Stinger GT boosts my confidence to the stratosphere and leaves me giddier than a toddler at Disneyland, but the engineers observing my behavior know the truth. Their meticulous work over the past few months, fine-tuning and polishing the sedan’s dynamic characteristics in advance of its launch later this year, are the real reason why the automotive enthusiast within me has been so captivated — they’ve done a superb job.
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2018 Kia Stinger GT
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Unread 2017-03-31, 09:40 AM   #59
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Kia Stinger 0-60 time under 4.9 seconds



When you think of Kia, one vehicle characteristic that doesn't spring to mind is acceleration. The automaker is hoping to change that with its 2018 Stinger.
The stylish sport sedan will be offered with two powertrains at launch, and the more potent of these, a 365-horsepower twin-turbocharged 3.3-liter V-6, will enable 0-62 mph acceleration in 4.9 seconds. This is with the standard 8-speed automatic and rear-wheel drive setup.
Since this figure is for 0-62 mph acceleration, the 0-60 time should be even lower. Kia had previously hinted at 0-62 mph acceleration of 5.1 seconds, though this was only a target and not the actual performance result.


2018 Kia Stinger fitted with carbon fiber pack, 2017 Seoul auto show

Kia announced the 4.9-second figure at the Stinger’s Korean debut which took place earlier today at the 2017 Seoul auto show. Kia also used the Korean debut to present the Stinger in a new yellow paint finish and fitted with a carbon fiber pack that uses the lightweight material for the grille surround, air intakes and hood vents.
In this day of blistering numbers put up by everything from electronically assisted hyper machines to your standard 707-horsepower muscle sedans, 4.9 seconds doesn't exactly overwhelm. But stop and think about it for a second and realize that we’re talking about a Kia sedan that will blast from 0-60 mph faster than the previous-gen Ford Mustang GT. That's pretty darn quick.
If that’s a little too hot for you to handle, the Stinger will also be offered with a 255-hp turbocharged 2.0-liter inline-4. In other markets, there will also be a 197-hp turbocharged 2.2-liter inline-4 diesel. Sales start in late 2017.

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Unread 2017-04-05, 11:22 PM   #60
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Stinger Fastback Sedan Leads Way Upmarket for Kia


Kia’s upper-brand strategy appears similar to the approach its Hyundai affiliate took in launching its separate Genesis line. But it’s not clear whether Kia will go global with this plan or keep it within South Korea.



Stinger debuts at premium end of Korean market.





SEOUL – Kia’s rollout of its’18 Stinger at the Seoul auto show was both a preview of the fastback sports sedan for the domestic market and an historical moment in the evolution of the automaker’s marketing strategy, an executive says.
With the Stinger, Kia is launching the automaker’s new premium-line strategy for Korea, according to Chang Sik Kim, executive vice president-sales and marketing.
The Stinger is the first of several high-priced rear-wheel-drive models that will wear a new “E” class sub-brand badge, he says.
“We at Kia Motors have made strenuous efforts to increase our brand value,” Kim explains. “Our premium lineup of rear-wheel-drive cars starts with Stinger, which will be marketing leveraged to Kia’s strength in design competitiveness.
“Next year a large premium model will be added to the premium line when we introduce the successor to the current K9 (called the K900 in the U.S. and Canada and Quoris in other international markets).”
Kim explains the premium line will be marketed separately but will remain under the Kia brand umbrella. All vehicles in the premium lineup will wear a new “E” badge to differentiate them, he says.
The badge consists of the new premium-line logo, which is formed with a stylized capital letter “E” surrounded by a broad silver circle. As applied to the Stinger, the vehicle’s name appears understatedly embossed in the lower portion of the circle.
When other brands are added to the lineup, the logo will remain the same, with the name of the vehicle applied to the bottom half of the circle.
It’s not clear whether Kia will take this premium-line strategy global or keep it within South Korea. Korea may be a test bed for the new upscale marketing concept.
Kia’s upper-brand strategy appears similar to the approach its Hyundai affiliate took in launching its separate Genesis line.
A spokesperson tells WardsAuto Kia’s new premium-line strategy applies only to South Korea for now. The new logo will be used only on vehicles sold in Korea, she says.
Gregory Guillaume, chief designer at the Kia European Design Center, spoke at the Stinger’s unveiling in Seoul about the coupe his Frankfurt-based team designed.
Guillaume says the Stinger is all about the joy of grand touring, of driving in open spaces and about passion, but “not with a burning desire to arrive at a destination first.”
Kia President Peter Schreyer, who is the chief design officer for both Kia and Hyundai, attended the auto-show presentation. He stayed very close to the team during development of the GT Concept on which the Stinger is based, and throughout every moment of the production car’s design evolution.
Schreyer is pleased with the outcome, and that Kia’s “latest baby,” as he calls it, has inspired the new premium-line strategy in South Korea.
One of the Stingers featured at the show was specially prepared to show off a new high-strength, lightweight carbon-fiber kit that includes the grille surround, air intakes and hood vents.
Also revealed at the show was a new speed spec for the Stinger equipped with a 365-hp twin-turbo V-6 and manual transmission. In that package the Stinger can hit 0-100 km/h (62 mph) in just 4.9 seconds, meaning it can do the traditional American 0-60 mph (161-km) sprint even faster.
The Stinger also is offered in Korea with a 251-hp 2.0L inline turbocharged 4-cyl. gasoline mill. Diesels are big sellers in Korea, so a 202-hp 2.2L turbodiesel is available in that market.
The Stinger will sell in Korea in both 2-wheel and all-wheel-drive versions
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Unread 2017-04-18, 03:01 PM   #61
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Kia Stinger GT to get BMW-style, dynamic suspension tweaks for Australia






The Kia Stinger GT’s Australian-market suspension tuning will focus on maximising driving character and response, with product from BMW, Mercedes-Benz and even Lexus cited as key benchmarks, as much as the beloved Commodore SS.
Due in Australia around September — before any other export market — the rear-wheel-drive Stinger liftback is being billed as a halo car for the brand with genuine volume potential that can fill a gap left behind by the outgoing big Aussie-made sedans.
Like all Kia product, it is getting substantial ‘localisation’ work done on the suspension to suit our market — in other words to make it firmer and potentially louder than the models sold in Korea and the US, and similar to what Kia UK is planning.

This includes giving the car a typical RWD character, meaning a propensity to get a little loose under heavy throttle, plus ample feel-and-feedback through the wheel. Given the global program was led by ex-BMW M chief Albert Biermann, expect nothing less.
Part of the Australian work could even include local exhaust tweaks — pending cost viability. We understand that several Kia regions worldwide are keenly aware that the GT’s 3.3-litre twin-turbocharged V6 needs a snappier, more cracking note than test models offer.
Noise aside, the flagship Stinger GT’s 3.3-litre twin-turbo makes 272kW of power and 510Nm of torque, and as we revealed a few weeks back gives the roughly Commodore-sized car a claimed zero to 100km/h time of just 4.9 seconds in RWD form.

This claim matches the locally-produced Commodore SS-V – which features a much larger 6.2-litre naturally-aspirated ‘LS3’ V8 producing 304kW of power and 570Nm of torque – while also beating the 5.2-second target set when the Kia was revealed.
It’ll be mated to an eight-speed automatic gearbox with steering wheel mounted paddle-shifters, and also sport a mechanical limited slip differential. A smaller 190kW/353Nm 2.0-litre turbo offering will also be available, though 75 per cent of Aussie demand will be for the six.
As with the suspension and steering, up to five different shift patterns may be selected through the vehicle’s electronic drive-mode system. Throttle mapping is also adjusted accordingly. The 3.3-litre V6 is shod with ultra-high performance rubber; 225/40R-19 in front and 255/35R-19 at the rear. Vented Brembo disc brakes (350mm) are standard.

Kia Australia COO Damien Meredith said the company “couldn’t help but be excited” about the Stinger GT’s arrival, adding that positioning was (obviously) vital.
We’d imagine a 2.0-litre price in the mid-to-high $40k range, and two twin-turbo V6 variants topping out around the mid-to-high $50k area may be about right.
Unlike Europe, where the car will be positioned as a cut-price German rival, Meredith said Kia Australia would take a different tack. Here, it will go after the Commodore SS-V market.

“We believe Australia is unique in regards to the history of its local manufacturing, we are of the view there’s a pool there that has been left by closing manufacturing, and we think we can fill that.
“Whether it’s a wading pool or Olympic pool, we don’t know yet!
“But to give you an idea we will either have 2-3 variants of the 2.0 and 3.3, and we certainly won’t be silly with our pricing.”

Volume-wise, Meredith said early supply would limit the company to about 200-300 units per month, but expect about 400 sales per month in 2018, 300 or so of which will be the GT flagship.
“Isn’t it great to have a halo you can get some volume out of?” he asked, rhetorically, adding that the company held about 30 orders already and was taking details of a few hundred prospective buyers per week leading up to the launch.

Stinger Design
The Stinger was designed in Frankfurt, overseen by Kia’s global design chief and former Audi staffer Peter Schreyer, with Gregory Guillaume, Kia’s European design head, as project lead.
It sports classic RWD proportions, with a short front overhang. The brand-signature ‘Tiger’ grille has been sharpened, and sits above a diffuser with distinctive fins, and is beset by angry headlights with LEDs.
Beyond this is a long, sculpted bonnet with twin vents, leading into a coupe-style sportback roof. The doors sport strong shoulder lines, leading to a long rear overhang with muscular haunches and a distinctive light treatment and rear diffuser.

Cabin
There’s more than a subtle nod to Mercedes-Benz in the vents and fascia layout, right? The layout is contemporary, with a floating tablet screen sitting above a series of infotainment and climate/ventilation controls.
There’s heavy use of real leather trims and metal, while the seats in higher grades are trimmed in proper Nappa hide.
A colour TFT screen between the analogue gauges relays performance data such as cornering G-forces, lap times and engine-oil temperature, along with ancillary information such as the trip computer, driver settings, navigation and diagnostics.
The Stinger’s cargo area is also larger than many in its class, according to Kia, with enough space for full-size luggage or golf bags, and a power boot available.
Features on offer (depending on spec, final Australian details not confirmed) include AEB with pedestrian detection, full-stop radar cruise control, blind-spot monitoring and rear-cross traffic alert. Other tech includes a head-up display, wireless charging pad, and a premium 15-speaker 720 watt Harmon/Kardon audio system for the top-spec variant/s.

Chassis
Development of the Stinger’s dynamics was centred at the Nurburgring, led by former BMW M Division executive Albert Biermann.
At 4831mm long, the Stinger is 160mm shorter than the current Commodore, though it’s almost as wide. The 2906mm wheelbase is also only 9mm shorter than the Holden’s, promising good rear legroom.
The chassis comprises 55 per cent ultra-high strength steel made by Hyundai/Kia, promises the necessary body stiffness for sharp handling and good NVH suppression.
The suspension is a MacPherson strut arrangement at the front and a multi-link independent rear. The Stinger is also the first Kia with adjustable dampers. This same set of driving modes also adjust the resistance programmed into the electric-assisted power steering.
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Unread 2017-04-27, 12:52 PM   #62
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BMW 4 Series rival: First drive in the Kia Stinger prototype

The Korean rival to the German powerhouse is looking good


This is still a prototype but we’ve driven two versions, on road and track. The aim, according to Kia, is to place the sportier Stinger GT just about under the Audi S5, so that’s aiming pretty high. The more mainstream Stinger, with a 2.2-litre diesel engine, is aiming at the BMW 4 Series. Can it be a hit?
It’s certainly large, you can see that in the photos. The wheelbase is a lengthy 2.9m, and overall it’s 4.83m, bigger than an Audi A5 Sportback. That’s apparent inside, with copious space although final fit and materials has yet to be signed off. We hope what is signed off is slightly higher quality than what we sat in, as this needs to be premium inside and out.
The 2.2-litre diesel, with its 197bhp, pulls strongly and steadily through its eight-speed auto transmission. You can have drive modes as standard, with Comfort fulfilling its brief although we were less impressed by the weightier steering response in Sport.



The suspension doesn’t have modes, just passive dampers but they gave a decent account of themselves, aided perhaps by that long wheelbase adding some stability to the equation.
Adaptive dampers are standard on the hotter version, the Stinger GT. This has a 370bhp V6 so more control is welcomed. It feels quick although it doesn’t sound that rorty. In Comfort mode it performed well but it was hard to tell much of a difference in handling if you clicked it up to Sport. Perhaps it could go a little stiffer for production.



It handled decently on the road, but the track made it seem a bit soft and floaty. However, that did show up a rather fun ability for this rear-wheel drive saloon to indulge in some safe and predictable oversteer. There’s a mechanical limited-slip differential on every model, and that helped to slide around using the gutsy and broad powerband of the V6.
We look forward to driving finished versions but, so far, the signs are promising that Kia can take on the premium marques at their own game.



Location Surrey
On sale September
Price £41,000 (est)
Engine V6, 3.3-litre, turbocharged, petrol
Power 370bhp; Torque 376lb ft
Gearbox eight-speed automatic
Kerb weight1800kg (est)
Top speed168mph
0-62mph 5.1sec (est)
Economy tbc; CO2/tax band tbc
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Unread 2017-05-03, 02:07 PM   #63
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Kia Stinger: Australian arm “determined” to get the sound right











On track for a late 2017 Australian launch, Kia Australia says local tuning and development of the much-anticipated Kia Stinger is progressing well, with the next major challenge being to ensure the rear-wheel-drive, four-door sports sedan sounds as good as it can.
Speaking exclusively to CarAdvice, Kia Australia media and corporate communications general manager Kevin Hepworth said the upcoming Stinger is “the most exciting model we’ve ever had” and getting the right exhaust on it is hugely important.
“We’re determined to get the right sound from the car,” Hepworth said, while revealing that the local team isn’t expecting to have the job finalised until August.

CarAdvice understands that a variable (or Holden Commodore-style bi-modal) exhaust system is unlikely to find its way onto the potentially potent Kia Stinger GT flagship, meaning the 4.9-second 0-100km/h-claiming car will likely only offer a ‘fixed’ system.
Hepworth, however, did also confirm that all local suspension tuning and evaluation work is now “done and dusted”, assuring interested parties that the brand’s new halo car is most definitely “a special piece of kit”.
Planned to launch locally in early September, the Kia Stinger range is expected to kick off around the mid-$40k mark, and comprise two to three trim variants for each of the two powerplants offered. That will mean entry-level, mid-spec, and full-fruit versions of both the 190kW/353Nm turbocharged 2.0-litre four-cylinder and 272kW/510Nm twin-turbocharged 3.3-litre V6.

Despite the most powerful offering still coming in 32kW and 60Nm shy of the 304kW/570Nm naturally-aspirated 6.2-litre LS3 V8 in the current, but fated, Holden Commodore SS, SS V, and SS V Redline, come 2018, the Kia Stinger will be the only rear-wheel-drive large car on sale in Australia, priced below $60,000.
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Unread 2017-05-08, 09:48 AM   #64
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Kia Stinger: behind the design


As Kia leaps all guns blazing into a fight against the established premium sporting hegemony, we've met the designer of its bold challenger, the Stinger



"It’s like Christmas,” says Gregory Guillaume, as we both stare wide-eyed at the car.




I’m not seeing a lot of tinsel or coloured lights, but I do see what still excites Kia’s European design chief about a project he began as a concept around seven years ago.
He’s talking about the graceful and unmistakable rear-drive proportions of the new Kia Stinger, the four-door GT Guillaume believes will complete a “paradigm shift” for the Korean brand when it hits the market early next year. Good proportions are like a Christmas present: start with those and it’s much easier to build great-looking cars.

Standing next to the new Stinger, the key facets of the layout become obvious: the long bonnet, the short front overhang, the low roof of a cabin pushed to the rear and, above all, the generous dash-to-axle dimension that clearly advertises the fact that there’s a potent north-south engine in there, driving either the rear wheels or, in some cases, all of them.
It looks so different from the Kias and Renaults and Fords we know, the workaday, nose-heavy, frontwheel-drive creations that crowd every cranny of the car market. This is a proper car, aimed specifically at enthusiasts. It will challenge the BMW 4 Series Gran Coupé and the Audi S5 Sportback from a direction they must have been expecting for a while. With a top model packing a 360bhp V6, a 5.1sec 0-62mph sprint time and a 160mph top speed, this Stinger will sit just below Europe’s most hardcore saloons, such as the BMW M3 and Mercedes-AMG C63, but not by much. In fact, it’s a little larger than its German peers, with Guillaume valuing length in cars for both its grace and its space. So the Stinger is 200mm longer than a 3 Series and nearly 100mm longer in the wheelbase – but it’s 58mm lower.
Guillaume, a life-long car lover in a way some design chiefs are not, defines the way in which the Stinger combines imposing proportions with power by referring to his inspiration, the Giugiaro-designed Maserati Ghibli of the early 1970s.
“We didn’t take anything from that car’s design,” he says, “but from its character. It was built for making journeys in great comfort across Europe, and that is the spirit of the car we set out to create.”
When you see it for the first time, you have to wonder why Kia didn’t press the button on the Stinger a long time ago, given that it’s closely related to the Kia GT concept revealed at the Frankfurt show in 2011. Kia has been noted for its design flair for a few years now, impressing with its SUVs and small cars, and Guillaume is one of the pioneers of Kia’s era of good design, arriving slightly before colleague Peter Schreyer, who is also credited as leader of a revolution.

But there’s more to a car like this than building it, says Guillaume. “It’s not easy just to launch yourself into a car like Stinger,” he explains. “You have to know the timing is right, and that the brand has the credibility to carry such an emotional product that aims challenge some of Europe’s best. We believe we’ve reached that stage.”
Another important point was knowing the car would have the underpinnings to match its looks, an area where Korean cars have failed in the past. These concerns led the company to hire Albert Biermann, former head of BMW’s M division, as chief engineer. Guillaume proudly remembers Biermann’s first reaction at the sight the Stinger prototype: “Right,” he said. “We’ll have to make sure this car drives the way it looks…”
We’re meeting in Kia’s European design HQ, from which Guillaume usually operates, although he travels monthly to Korea. The Frankfurt viewing studio is five floors up, with a double-height ceiling, huge windows emitting a flood of natural light and giving a panoramic view of the city. Guillaume is showing us three models today: the original GT concept that usually lives in Korea, an interim full-size model used to investigate alternative design details and a fully representative late prototype, which has been in the UK doing road trials with Biermann and his team and was tested by this magazine earlier this month. Kia believes that a car that can handle UK roads will work everywhere.

We’re also seeing an amazing early cockpit buck with gold seats (“I thought that if we were doing something different we should take it quite far…”) and another much closer to the keep-it-real, driver-focused, “more analogue, more honest” treatment that was eventually chosen for production. Powertrain details are well known: two petrol engines, one diesel, all driving through an eight-speed torque converter auto with a similar degree of driver control to a typically European dual-clutch set-up. The car also has Brembo front brakes, 19in tyres that are differently sized front to rear on the top model and a new adaptive damping system. All the accoutrements a quick car is going to need, in other words.
We take a walk around the car with the man who inspired it, noting the finer features of the design, such as the prominent rear diffuser under a graceful coupé back-end, the subtle but strong rear haunches, the taillights connected by a reflector and the lower air scoop that carefully avoids stealing emphasis from the classically Kia ‘tiger nose’ grille.
Even for this emotional car, Guillaume says, there were numerous areas where design restraint was needed, such as leaving out a rear hatch. “We wanted the fastback look,” he explains, “but not the extra structure and weight of a hatch”. Likewise, they decided against an active rear spoiler because of weight, complexity and the fact that it would have introduced an extra rear shutline. But the original concept’s vents behind the front wheels were kept (Guillaume calls them “breathers”), because they have a genuine function in reducing aero pressure in the wheel housings.
Guillaume’s favourite feature is the Coke-bottle shape, which isn’t very noticeable at first but becomes more implicit as you gain familiarity with the exterior. “It’s represents the car’s whole character,” he says. “It’s relatively subtle, but powerful, too.”
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Unread 2017-05-08, 09:50 AM   #65
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Kia “Actively Looking” At Supercars Entry With Stinger GT





































Kia’s first rear-wheel drive passenger car, the Stinger, is set to go on sale later this year, providing the ideal opportunity for the Korean automaker to join the grid of Australia’s Supercars Championship.
Any move into motorsport wouldn’t happen overnight though, with Kia Australia COO Damien Meredith revealing 2020 as the earliest date possible for a potential Supercars entrant.
In an interview with TMR at the Australian launch of the new Picanto, Mr Meredith revealed that the company was still evaluating entering motor racing and wouldn’t be drawn on which Supercar teams might be approached.
Kia Australia is believed to have opened initial discussions with numerous Supercars teams including former Holden factory team Walkinshaw Racing and former Volvo squad Garry Rogers Motorsport about developing a Supercars package.

Walkinshaw Racing's current Supercars entrant

"It's something we're actively looking at. We've talked to Supercars. We've talked to, not a lot of teams, but a few teams,” Mr Meredith explained.
“If we did it, it probably wouldn't be until 2020 anyway because we wouldn't jump in. There's a lot, us as an organisation has to learn. I just don't think if you jump in there and say 'there you go guys' there's a lot of learnings you need to compile, so it wouldn't be until 2020, if we did."
Changes to Supercars regulations for the 2017 sees the series move away from naturally aspirated V8s as the sole engine option, allowing teams to develop turbocharged six and four-cylinder engines, opening the door to a race-prepped version of the Stinger’s 3.3-litre twin-turbo V6.


Meredith explained that while no final decision had yet been made, he sees Supercars as a good fit for the brand and the right place to showcase the Stinger’s performance attributes.
"I think the way we're going to position Stinger I think it would be great to have it racing on weekends," he said. "But whether or not we've got the DNA or can create the DNA, that remains to be seen."
With Supercars facing a shakeup as competing teams switch from their traditional Holden Commodore and Ford Falcon-based race programs, which have underpinned the series for decades, it seems fresh manufacturer interest could be just what the series needs to continue its revitalisation onto the next decade.
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Unread 2017-05-15, 08:36 AM   #66
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Kia targeting fleet customers with StingerPolice interested in pre-production car spotted at fleet conference







Kia Australia is using the Stinger to reel in fleet customers, displaying a pre-production Stinger GT at a recent Melbourne fleet manager’s conference.
When local Commodore and Camry production wraps up later this year, companies previously tied to Australian large cars will have the ability to look elsewhere.

Stinger will launch in Australia with two rear-wheel drive variants, a 2.0-litre turbocharged four-cylinder petrol that produces 190kW of power (10kW more than the Optima) and 353Nm of torque, and the flagship GT.
The GT uses a 3.3-litre turbocharged V6 engine that produces 272kW of power and 510Nm of torque. Both engine variants are still being tuned for Australia (along with exhausts), so power figures could change prior to the car’s launch.
According to Kevin Hepworth, general manager of media and corporate communications at Kia Australia, the company isn’t hunting Commodore and Camry sales, but it seems the logical target.

“I think it is fair to say that Stinger is going to offer a lot to fleet customers _ particularly the 2.0T. I’m not so sure we are so much pushing it as a replacement for the Commodore/Camry/Falcon markets but that is an area of the fleet world which is changing and Stinger is certainly an option for fleet buyers to consider,” Hepworth said.
“As for the 3.3, there has been a lot of initial interest from various police forces and they represent enormous fleet potential.”

The Stinger generated a fair bit of buzz at the conference, which included “keynote addresses, plenaries and insightful presentations and workshops from professionals who are experts in their chosen field”.
The powerful V6 Stinger struck the right chord with police fleet buyers, who were also present at the conference.
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Unread 2017-05-17, 03:24 PM   #67
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Kia plans hotter Stinger




The standard Kia Stinger GT is still yet to reach showrooms, however there are already plans for a faster version.
According to a representative from Kia’s local arm, the Stinger story won’t end with the 276kW/510Nm 3.3-litre twin-turbo V6 GT, with development boss Albert Biermann keen to produce a more focused version of the Korean brand’s first serious performance car.
Kia Australia’s General Manager of Media and Corporate Communications, Kevin Hepworth, told MOTOR that Biermann was happy to make it known during the Stinger GT’s launch at the Detroit Auto Show that he’s already looked into the possibility of a sharper Stinger, stating there’s definitely more he can do with it.
These are encouraging words from a man who formerly headed BMW’s M Division and is now responsible for the fast car ambitions of both Kia and Hyundai through its standalone performance brand N.


Biermann was tight-lipped on exactly what form his “Stinger Special” will take, including whether the modifications would be limited to chassis work or include more power, however his dedication to the project is evident in the fact that local engineering teams will not be allowed to touch the car.
According to Hepworth, Biermann is happy for Kia Australia’s talented local development crew, including suspension guru Graeme Gambold, to put its own touches on the Stinger GT, modifying the steering, suspension and possibly the exhaust to suit Australian conditions, however when it comes to ‘Biermann’s Stinger’ it will be very definitely a case of hands off.
Kia is keen to offer a performance model across its entire range, however has ruled out a dedicated sub-brand like Hyundai’s N. The Stinger arrives locally in September with the GT expected to be priced around $50,000.
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Unread 2017-06-11, 07:02 PM   #68
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Yes, The Kia Stinger GT Can Drift and Here's the Videos to Prove It



Everybody saw the Stinger GT drifting on the ice. But even the Volkswagen Golf R can do that. No, we're more interested in the type of drifting that turns tires into smoke, and the latest videos prove the Korean sports sedan's repertoire does include such skills.

The footage comes from a recent test drive event in Korea, the first market to get the most exciting Kia product ever. As you can probably hear, the red rooster is powered by the 3.3-liter twin-turbo V6 engine, which can take you from 0 to 60 in under 5 seconds.

There have been some pretty powerful Kia sedans in the past, but none of them have had the suspension tuning and rear differential to consistently transition in and out of drifts. Of course, a professional driver is behind the wheel, so your average ham-fisted bloke might not be this graceful.

The range-topping GT version of the car is aimed squarely at things like the BMW 4 Series, Mercedes-AMG C43, and Audi S5 Sportback. Some of those are faster by 0.2 seconds. But once you factor in the expected sub-$50,000 price of this model, a couple of tens of a second disappear from your thoughts. That's going to be the bargain of the year, considering the M2 stickers for $52,500.

Perhaps unsurprisingly, Kia did a lot of testing on a particular German track to ensure that its budget-minded Merc alternative is fun. The project was under the direct control of Albert Biermann, the former VP of Engineering at BMW M and also the guy in charge of the i30 N.

Besides the 365-horsepower V6, the Stinger will also be offered in a couple of regular flavors, namely a 2.0-liter gasoline turbo and a 2.2-liter diesel that's aimed squarely at the Europeans. Like on the Genesis G80 sister car, AWD is available too, complete with torque vectoring.


Something went wrong. Please make sure you added the video correctly.

Video URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpBN0YeRMZw
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Video URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poQjGeQApTI
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Unread 2017-06-11, 07:03 PM   #69
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[Test Drive] Kia Stinger GT: authentic road monster







The Kia Motors Stinger GT sports sedan / Courtesy of Kia Motors


Kia Motors recently held a test drive for its Stinger GT sedan, a highly anticipated model the carmaker hopes will spearhead the nation's sports sedan market that has seen a long-standing duopoly between BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

The Stinger GT can accelerate to 100 kilometers per hour in 4.9 seconds, the fastest among locally produced models.

And a few hours were enough to recognize its darting nature throughout the test drive. It is mounted with a 3.3-liter V6 twin-turbo GDi engine that produces a maximum 370 horsepower with a 52.0 kgf.m torque.

This reporter drove the sports sedan from the Sheraton Walkerhill Hotel in Seoul, to Wonju, Gangwon Province _ a distance of about 100 kilometers.

The Stinger GT's initial response in acceleration was surprisingly punchy enough for a driver to perceive reverse gravity under full-throttle acceleration with a growling exhaust sound.

The Stinger GT's explosive acceleration didn't feel tired even at very high speeds while the automatic eight-speed transmission responded promptly both with upshifts and downshifts.

All model levels, including not only the Stinger GT but also its lower versions, feature a dual Macpherson strut in the front and a five-way multilink suspension in the rear, a similar structure to the BMW sports sedans.

Featuring powerful Brembo brake calipers as well as 19-inch Michelin Summer tires guaranteed an immediate brake response even at high speed, luring a driver to step on the gas pedal down to the floor during the test drive.

It also features a rack-mounted motor driven power steering system in which the electric motor module controlling the steering is mounted directly on the steering rack. The Stinger GT's steering was light at low speed but became heavy and precise at high speed.

The vehicle has five driving modes -- eco, comfort, smart, sport and custom -- boasting its all-round nature of a daily car and a darting road machine.

In custom mode, it allows a driver to choose suspension, virtual exhaust sound and steering settings in accordance with the driver's preference.

The Stinger GT is also a great daily car in eco mode. Although the model is a sports sedan, it has a complex drive range of 9.2 kilometers per liter in that mode.

Its bucket seats provided unparalleled comfort compared to other domestically produced sedans. This reporter drove the model for about three hours at high speed, but didn't feel tired.

The Stinger GT is priced at 48.8 million won ($43,455), similar to BMW's 3-Series sedans.

Kia Motors has focused mainly on producing volume models for better sales performance, but a Kia official said the Stinger GT exclusively targets the nation's motorsports fans.

The official said sales of the Stinger sedan have reached 2,700 and the number is expected to easily exceed this year's target of 8,000.
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Unread 2017-06-11, 07:04 PM   #70
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Kia Stinger: Australian equipment details revealed in leaked bulletin








A number of key equipment details for the incoming new 2018 Kia Stinger liftback sedan have been revealed, thanks to a dealer bulletin obtained by CarAdvice reader Joe.
Although the all-important pricing details are still to be confirmed, CarAdvice can confirm the Stinger will be offered locally in six grades, split equally across the already confirmed 2.0-litre four-cylinder and 3.3-litre six-cylinder turbocharged petrol engines.
The 190kW/353Nm four-cylinder Stinger will kick off with the 200S, with mid-range 200Si and top-shelf GT-Line models sitting above.

Full details for the four-cylinder models were not included with the bulletin, but, as it does with the Sportage, the GT-Line will likely represent a styling pack rather than any significant sporting enhancements.
The six-cylinder models will include the entry-level 330S and mid-spec 330Si, with the much-hyped GT to sit atop the range. Only recently, Kia confirmed buyers can expect a 0-100km/h time of just 4.9 seconds for the Stinger GT, likely putting the 272kW/510Nm turbo liftback on more than a few shopping lists.
According to the dealer bulletin obtained by CarAdvice, equipment highlights for the 330S will include driving systems like a variable gear ratio steering setup, a limited-slip differential and Brembo brakes – although details more specific than this are still to come.

The 330S also lists keyless entry with push-button start, cloth seats with artificial leather seat bolsters and inserts, a 7.0-inch display with satellite navigation and SUNA traffic updates, along with 10 years of free map updates, and connectivity with Apple CarPlay and Android Auto.
Autonomous emergency braking (AEB) will not be standard with the 330S, although it may prove to be available as an option. To get the potentially life-saving and at least bumper-protecting technology as standard equipment, buyers will need to step up to the 330Si.
That model also adds lane-keep assist and smart cruise control, along with rain-sensing wipers, 19-inch alloy wheels (up from presumably 18-inch on the 330S), a larger 8.0-inch display (with all the goodies listed above), nine-speaker audio (330S speaker number not noted), and a full leather interior.

Splashing out on the top-shelf GT, which is expected to be priced in the neighbourhood of $50,000 before on-road costs, will add blind-spot monitoring, driver-selectable suspension options, LED headlights, powered tilt/reach steering column, a slide/tilt powered sunroof, upgraded Nappa leather, memory driver’s seat, 15-speaker Harman/Kardon audio, and a head-up display.
Standard colour options for the 200S, 200Si, 330S and 330Si will include Panthera Metal (a dark purple), Silky Silver, Ceramic Grey, Sunset Yellow, Hichroma Red and Micro Blue, while Deep Chrome Blue will be offered as a cost option.
For the GT-Line and GT, standard colours will include Silky Silver, Ceramic Grey, Sunset Yellow, Hichroma Red and Micro Blue, adding Dark Chroma Blue, Snow White Pearl and Aurora Black as cost options.
Colours in the cabin will be limited to black for the 200S, 200Si, 330S and 330Si, while GT-Line and GT buyers can add red leather to the list of considerations.

Lower-specification models are likely to be popular with fleet buyers, with Kia Australia communications manager Kevin Hepworth telling CarAdvice in May the company will welcome buyers previously committed to the Commodore, Falcon and Camry – among others.
“I think it is fair to say that Stinger is going to offer a lot to fleet customers – particularly the 2.0T. I’m not so sure we are so much pushing it as a replacement for the Commodore/Camry/Falcon markets but that is an area of the fleet world which is changing and Stinger is certainly an option for fleet buyers to consider,” Hepworth said.
“As for the 3.3, there has been a lot of initial interest from various police forces and they represent enormous fleet potential.”
The Stinger will make its Australian debut in the third quarter of this year, with more official details to be revealed as its launch draws near.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 07:17 PM   #71
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2018 Kia Stinger GT Track Drive Review

Love At First Sting







“Rock You Like A Hurricane” is the song that got me into rock ’n’ roll, the first song I learned on the cheap Squire Stratocaster copy I begged my mom to buy me, and the reason every Motor Trend test car has SiriusXM’s Hair Nation stored in its radio presets. 1984’s Love At First Sting album cemented the Scorpions’ place in pop culture history, led by the band’s second-highest-charting single ever, from which it borrowed its name. I was thinking about all of this just before setting out on the Nürburgring Nordscheife in the 2018 Kia Stinger GT, less than four hours’ drive from the Scorpions hometown in Hanover, wondering if this wildly out of character Kia would inspire any feelings similar to the first time I heard that song.
I had very little time to think after that.
In all my years in this job, this is the first opportunity I’ve had to drive the ’Ring. In all the coverage we’ve given the new Stinger, this is the first time I’ve sat behind the wheel, period. None of this was communicated to the driver of the car we were instructed to follow, a Belgian pro racer hired by Kia to help with durability testing on the ’Ring, nor was he apparently informed the first lap was to be a warm-up. Within five seconds of entering the track, he had the throttle pinned, and it was up to me to keep up with him. I’m not entirely convinced he was aware he was leading journalists at all and not just doing hot laps. We never spoke, before, during, or after. Our cars were equipped with radios. They stayed silent.

View all 40 Photos





This story illustrates beautifully how easy it is to drive the Stinger GT quickly. I got behind the wheel of a car I’d never driven on a track I’d never been to (the freaking Nürburgring, no less) and kept up with the hired gun not because I’m the world’s best driver but because the Stinger GT is just that confident and composed on a racetrack.
The first indication is the solidity. It doesn’t quite have that carved-from-granite feel of a Mercedes-Benz, but it’s close. The Stinger GT feels purposefully heavy, pressed into the ground by an unseen hand and making the best use of the grip it affords. At roughly 3,800 pounds in rear-wheel-drive form, it could actually stand to lose a little weight, but it manages the weight it has well. (Note: Our test cars were fully loaded with sunroofs, 15-speaker stereos, heated and cooled front seats, and more.) The adjustable dampers (standard on the GT model), used exclusively in their Sport setting, do a commendable job of controlling body motions and allowing the car to lean on its outside tires rather than flop onto them. (Another note: Our test cars were equipped with slightly stiffer European-spec dampers.) For track duty, I’d prefer a bit less roll before the weight is transferred, but I suspect I wouldn’t mind it on the road.
That transitional stability is what really sells the Stinger GT’s handling credentials. Larger and heavier than most cars Kia benchmarked, such as the 3 Series, A4, and C-Class, the Stinger GT is incredibly neutral on track. Weight transfers smoothly while mid-corner bumps are absorbed skillfully and without upsetting the chassis. The handling limit default behavior is, predictably for a street car, mild to moderate understeer, provoked by trying to carry too much speed into a corner far more often than trying to exit too quickly.









The steering itself, though not the greatest electric power steering on the market, is very good and the best Kia’s ever produced. The rack-mounted motor never lets the steering get too heavy, as many automakers tend to do when attempting to convey a sporty feeling, nor does it confiscate feedback from the road. Information from the front tires is muted, but it’s there, and it tells you what’s coming with enough detail to respond quickly. The ratio is variable, but it’s done mechanically in the gearing, so it never changes. Steering just off center is a bit slow, good for high-speed stability, and more aggressive as you turn farther. To really attack a racetrack, I’d make it a little more aggressive, but it’s just what you’d want in a GT car.
At the other end, the Stinger GT’s rear wheels stay planted seemingly no matter what you throw at them. A sharp crest could cause the rear to get light, and when it was located in a turn the rear would make small lateral movements as if it might come loose, but it never did. Trail braking, a heavy right foot, and the vagaries of the Green Hell couldn’t get it to come loose. Some credit goes to the suspension geometry but also to the mechanical limited-slip differential (an electronically controlled model is under development but wasn’t ready in time). From prior reporting, we know that when it does step out, the result is linear and easily controlled oversteer, which is good for drifting. That’s by design, intended to make the car predictable and manageable at the limit.

View all 40 Photos
A great deal of credit also goes to the Michelin Pilot Sport 3 tires designed specifically for this car. They displayed an impressive level of grip, especially in the rear, and were quick to recover from understeer when you backed off the steering. They made little noise at their limits, and after a day of lapping behind “instructors” apparently looking to beat personal records, barely showed any wear. It’s a testament to how well the chassis is using its tires.
I must similarly compliment the Brembo brakes (also standard on the GT). They took five all-out laps with almost no cooldown period between them, each lap including a haul down from nearly 155 mph right at the end, and never faded. I especially enjoyed the ease of modulating the brakes and the feel they returned, though for track work I would prefer slightly less pedal travel and a bit more bite. Here, again, I imagine it wouldn’t bother me on a back road at lower speeds. I am slightly concerned I’ll like the slightly less aggressive U.S.-spec brake pads, which are quieter and produce less dust, less than the European-spec pads on our test cars.
Not wanting to become the star of the latest Nürburgring crash compilation on YouTube, I elected to keep the traction and stability control on and in their Sport mode (which is tied to the Sport driving mode). I felt very few interventions, and those I did notice employed a very light touch, modulating the brakes and throttle only enough to keep the tires planted and pointed the right way. It’s another testament to the chassis the ESC has little work to do, though the mere fact this is the first Kia to allow you to fully defeat the ESC makes you want to do it just on principle.










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Unread 2017-06-19, 07:17 PM   #72
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If performance is your principle, you’ll want to stick with the rear-wheel-drive model. The Stinger GT is also offered with an all-wheel-drive system developed by a Hyundai Motor Group–owned supplier and utilizes an electronically controlled center clutch, open differentials, and brake-actuated torque vectoring. Kia claims the all-wheel-drive car will have a performance advantage in poor weather, but on a perfect summer’s day it saps some of the car’s character. Adding roughly 155 pounds to the nose doesn’t help the car’s heavy feeling, nor does it help with the understeer on corner entry. What’s more, it erases the steering feel. The brake torque vectoring does feel like it’s helping point the car out of a corner, but the nose doesn’t pull you out like a GT-R even when it’s sending the maximum 50 percent of engine torque to the front axle. If you live in an area with chronically poor weather, it’s worth considering, but otherwise, the rear-drive car is more fun all around.
Also putting a small damper on the fun factor is the turbo lag and throttle response, which is especially evident on the heavier all-wheel-drive car. Although the 365-hp, 376 lb-ft twin-turbocharged V-6 has just the right amount of muscle for the car, it’s slow to respond at corner exit. The turbos seem to be at fault, judging by how slowly the boost gauge comes up. The lag is noticeable enough a work-around is needed, the best of which is to simply floor the gas pedal as soon as you clip the apex. By the time the boost comes on, momentum will have carried you out to the exit of the corner when you want the power.
The engine, a reworked version of Kia’s existing 3.3-liter V-6, is otherwise strong. When the boost is on, the Stinger GT is appropriately quick for its size and pretensions, hitting 60 mph in a claimed 4.9 seconds. It even makes a surprisingly pleasing growl in the cabin, no easy feat for a V-6, much less a turbocharged one. What’s more, Kia’s American representatives tell us they’ve ordered up a louder exhaust system for our market to give it a bit more presence because it’s rather quiet outside the car.

View all 40 Photos
The final piece of the puzzle is an in-house-designed and built eight-speed automatic transmission, the only option. It’s an excellent gearbox, performing as well on the track as the industry standard ZF eight-speed found in many European sport sedans. It changes gears quickly and smoothly, and the Sport mode programming is almost good enough not to need the paddles on track. I’d make it a little more aggressive myself, but it’s close. As for the paddles, their response is a bit slow and inconsistent, and the gearbox will automatically upshift at redline, which always seems to arrive more quickly than anticipated.
Elsewhere behind the wheel, the Stinger GT presents an excellent driver’s seat with adjustable side bolsters. It offers great lateral support and keeps you firmly planted in the seat no matter how hard you drive. Unfortunately, the front passenger’s seat is wider with fixed, less aggressive bolsters, allowing occupants to be tossed around more than they ought to. The steering wheel itself is appropriately thick without overdoing it like a BMW M car. The rear window is quite small, rather like a BMW 6 Series, but the outward visibility is otherwise good.
Although Kia conducted our first real driving opportunity on the Nürburgring, it’s pitching the Stinger and Stinger GT as high-performance grand touring cars, not track specials. Some aspects of the car are deliberately softened to make it more pleasant in real-world driving, though not so much as to hurt its sporty character on a back road. Rather than take on an M4 or C63, the Stinger GT hopes to muscle in on the 440i M Sport and C43 AMG. After my experience, I would also suggest anyone interested in over-priced and under-styled Chevrolet SS give this car serious consideration, as well. It might not have the V-8 rumble and stick shift, but it’s otherwise a solid alternative. Anyone wishing their Dodge Charger or Chrysler 300 could go around a corner with authority while still offering good interior space and a big trunk should also take a look.













Being Kia’s second-ever rear-drive sedan, it’s first-ever sport sedan, and the quickest car the company has ever sold, placing the Stinger and Stinger GT in the automotive world can be difficult. With the turbocharged four-cylinder Stinger expected to start around $30,000 and the twin-turbo V-6 Stinger GT hoping to come in just under $40,000 and top out around $50,000, it’s playing right in the heart of the market with competitors of all types. It is at once a European-type grand tourer and also a big, powerful, roomy, rear-drive sedan Americans used to adore. It’s nice enough to impress a luxury car buyer in the same price range but affordable enough to be attainable to the average buyer. It’s sporty enough to make the established luxury sport sedan builders take notice and comfortable and stylish enough to get midsize sedan buyers to upgrade.
However Kia decides to pitch it and wherever the market chooses to place it, the Stinger GT is already a success. Kia has proved it can step outside of its comfort zone and build unfamiliar cars as well as its stalwarts. Moreover, Kia has proved it can build a sports car good enough to take on the world, on its first try, no less. Regardless of its place in history, the Stinger GT is simply a great sport sedan, and that’s something we can always get behind.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 07:22 PM   #73
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[Test Drive] Kia Stinger GT: authentic road monster



Camera
NIKON D4

Focal Length
24mm

Aperture
f/6.3

Exposure
1/100s

ISO
800




The Kia Motors Stinger GT sports sedan / Courtesy of Kia Motors
By Jhoo Dong-chan

Kia Motors recently held a test drive for its Stinger GT sedan, a highly anticipated model the carmaker hopes will spearhead the nation's sports sedan market that has seen a long-standing duopoly between BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

The Stinger GT can accelerate to 100 kilometers per hour in 4.9 seconds, the fastest among locally produced models.

And a few hours were enough to recognize its darting nature throughout the test drive. It is mounted with a 3.3-liter V6 twin-turbo GDi engine that produces a maximum 370 horsepower with a 52.0 kgf.m torque.

This reporter drove the sports sedan from the Sheraton Walkerhill Hotel in Seoul, to Wonju, Gangwon Province _ a distance of about 100 kilometers.

The Stinger GT's initial response in acceleration was surprisingly punchy enough for a driver to perceive reverse gravity under full-throttle acceleration with a growling exhaust sound.

The Stinger GT's explosive acceleration didn't feel tired even at very high speeds while the automatic eight-speed transmission responded promptly both with upshifts and downshifts.

All model levels, including not only the Stinger GT but also its lower versions, feature a dual Macpherson strut in the front and a five-way multilink suspension in the rear, a similar structure to the BMW sports sedans.

Featuring powerful Brembo brake calipers as well as 19-inch Michelin Summer tires guaranteed an immediate brake response even at high speed, luring a driver to step on the gas pedal down to the floor during the test drive.

It also features a rack-mounted motor driven power steering system in which the electric motor module controlling the steering is mounted directly on the steering rack. The Stinger GT's steering was light at low speed but became heavy and precise at high speed.

The vehicle has five driving modes -- eco, comfort, smart, sport and custom -- boasting its all-round nature of a daily car and a darting road machine.

In custom mode, it allows a driver to choose suspension, virtual exhaust sound and steering settings in accordance with the driver's preference.

The Stinger GT is also a great daily car in eco mode. Although the model is a sports sedan, it has a complex drive range of 9.2 kilometers per liter in that mode.

Its bucket seats provided unparalleled comfort compared to other domestically produced sedans. This reporter drove the model for about three hours at high speed, but didn't feel tired.

The Stinger GT is priced at 48.8 million won ($43,455), similar to BMW's 3-Series sedans.

Kia Motors has focused mainly on producing volume models for better sales performance, but a Kia official said the Stinger GT exclusively targets the nation's motorsports fans.

The official said sales of the Stinger sedan have reached 2,700 and the number is expected to easily exceed this year's target of 8,000.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 08:57 PM   #74
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I'd have a hard time picking this over a SS
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Unread 2017-06-19, 09:10 PM   #75
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easy: 1 exists ..1 doesn't (new)









*based on the fact that Holden stopped SS production
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