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Unread 2015-10-19, 11:03 AM   #1
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Default Looking For Input On Sportbike Search

The Honda CB400 I posted on here quite a while back is long since gone, and since then I have gone through an 883R Sportster that I only rode a couple times, and now I'm beating around on an old CB750. It's neat to look at, but the thing makes it's age known while you're riding it- heavy, underpowered, poor braking.

I'm looking around at 600 and similarly performing sportbikes, and feel like I've narrowed things down to 3 bikes. A Smokin Joes CBR600F3, a VTR1000F, and a Buell XB12R. I think I have a fair handle on the pros and cons of each, but what is your pick and why, or do you guys have another suggestion? I'm looking to stay under $4k, not afraid of carbs.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 11:13 AM   #2
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The Ducati Monster and SS with the 750 are great bikes. The 750 is a well-rounded motor, and is dead reliable. Super easy to work on, as well. It's a dual carb setup. These bikes fall well within your price range.

The SV650 (2004+) is fuel injected, you can get it naked, half-fared, or full-faired. This is an absolutely AMAZING platform. Great handling bike, with a good amount of grunt. These are favored buy a lot of track guys as one of the best bang-for-your-buck bikes. They're extremely reliable, too. You can get a low miles, extremely good condition example in your price range.


Of the bikes you posted, my vote would be the CBR. I'm not a big fan of Buells with the HD engine in them. They vibrate a lot, and just don't produce a great powerband, IMO. I don't know a ton about the VTR, so I'm not really comparing it to the others because of my ignorance about it.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 11:49 AM   #3
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The Ducati Monster and SS with the 750 are great bikes. The 750 is a well-rounded motor, and is dead reliable. Super easy to work on, as well. It's a dual carb setup. These bikes fall well within your price range.

The SV650 (2004+) is fuel injected, you can get it naked, half-fared, or full-faired. This is an absolutely AMAZING platform. Great handling bike, with a good amount of grunt. These are favored buy a lot of track guys as one of the best bang-for-your-buck bikes. They're extremely reliable, too. You can get a low miles, extremely good condition example in your price range.


Of the bikes you posted, my vote would be the CBR. I'm not a big fan of Buells with the HD engine in them. They vibrate a lot, and just don't produce a great powerband, IMO. I don't know a ton about the VTR, so I'm not really comparing it to the others because of my ignorance about it.
The sv650's are neat, but I would like a bit more power than that. Probably staying away from european bikes for now unless I go much newer later on.

These are all 3 bikes that are for sale right now, BTW
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Unread 2015-10-19, 11:52 AM   #4
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I'll be in the same boat next spring / summer. I'm a noob rider currently learning on a little 2009 Ninja 250R with 3k miles that I picked up for dirt cheap. Next year I'd like to get a used 600, or maybe just get a new CBR650F w/ ABS.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 11:52 AM   #5
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I knew a guy who had a smoking joe's bike. It was a pretty neat bike at the time. More comfy then the sport bikes of today.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 12:21 PM   #6
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I loved the F3 that I had. Really fun bike.

For $4k, I would look for a 929RR, IMO. Size/weight of a 600, power of a liter.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 01:12 PM   #7
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The sv650's are neat, but I would like a bit more power than that. Probably staying away from european bikes for now unless I go much newer later on.

These are all 3 bikes that are for sale right now, BTW
Honestly, there are some european bikes to stay away from, and some that are just as reliable as a jap bike. That's why I recommended the 750, specifically. It's a SERIOUSLY reliable motor and very easy to work on... more so than most bikes I have turned wrenches on. However, if you don't want one, you don't want one . Don't let the stigma steer you away from a great machine, though.

SV's do choke a bit on HP, but they make up for it with torque. They're a great city bike. You really only notice the lack of HP if you're drag racing.

The 3 bikes you listed are drastically different, and you might want to contact your insurance company about their premiums. That might influence your decision. Motorcycle insurance rates range VERY widely based on multiple factors. A quick call might help you narrow your search down.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 02:23 PM   #8
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Honestly, there are some european bikes to stay away from, and some that are just as reliable as a jap bike. That's why I recommended the 750, specifically. It's a SERIOUSLY reliable motor and very easy to work on... more so than most bikes I have turned wrenches on. However, if you don't want one, you don't want one . Don't let the stigma steer you away from a great machine, though.

SV's do choke a bit on HP, but they make up for it with torque. They're a great city bike. You really only notice the lack of HP if you're drag racing.

The 3 bikes you listed are drastically different, and you might want to contact your insurance company about their premiums. That might influence your decision. Motorcycle insurance rates range VERY widely based on multiple factors. A quick call might help you narrow your search down.
Most of my riding is open (and usually empty) roads in rural area around here, some in town, but not a ton. Lots of straights, not a lot of stops.

Especially with my driving record, I can't see too much of a shock in insurance, but I need to go in and check this week for sure. I'm leaning towards the F3, as the VTR has 10k more miles, but the Buell also sure does look like fun for my ~20 minute commute.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 02:28 PM   #9
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Buy my Vmax, Rick.

I'd give you a nice deal.
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Unread 2015-10-19, 02:38 PM   #10
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Buy my Vmax, Rick.

I'd give you a nice deal.
Sorry, man, I'm just not a cruiser guy at heart
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Unread 2015-10-19, 03:48 PM   #11
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Most of my riding is open (and usually empty) roads in rural area around here, some in town, but not a ton. Lots of straights, not a lot of stops.

Especially with my driving record, I can't see too much of a shock in insurance, but I need to go in and check this week for sure. I'm leaning towards the F3, as the VTR has 10k more miles, but the Buell also sure does look like fun for my ~20 minute commute.
You would be surprised. My insurance on a street triple vs. daytona (street triple being a 2014, daytona being a 2007, engine is the same, the daytona is just fared) for the same coverage with the same insurer is ~$60 a month vs. ~$200 a month.

The street triple is also after an at fault wreck hitting my insurance, so the difference should probably actually be even greater.

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Buy my Vmax, Rick.

I'd give you a nice deal.
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Sorry, man, I'm just not a cruiser guy at heart
a v-max isn't your typical cruiser. Those things go hard.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 07:44 AM   #12
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Most of my riding is open (and usually empty) roads in rural area around here, some in town, but not a ton. Lots of straights, not a lot of stops.
I dont get sportbike ownership in Kansas. Maybe a monster or another quick naked but I wouldn't own the MV if I lived in Kansas, just the Guzzi. Straight roads are the boringest as fuck when folded up on an uncomfortable superbike. Yeah you can go eleventy million miles an hour with JWDBfishes daughter on the back but any idiot can do that. Clip-ons are wrist murder when you are just bored cruising.

Id be doing a BMW K bike or a smaller 800 class touring, as fast as the sportbikes on the road for anything that makes sense and considerably more comfortable for slab riding.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 08:00 AM   #13
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a v-max isn't your typical cruiser. Those things go hard.
And you're not sore after riding several hours.

A few hundred bucks and it is a tossable bike.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 08:03 AM   #14
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I would love to get a vmax sometime - it may look more like a cruiser, but they haul ass. Out of the original listed, I would get the buell, but I am bias. I do think you can find very nice examples cheap though.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 08:28 AM   #15
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I dont get sportbike ownership in Kansas. Maybe a monster or another quick naked but I wouldn't own the MV if I lived in Kansas, just the Guzzi. Straight roads are the boringest as fuck when folded up on an uncomfortable superbike. Yeah you can go eleventy million miles an hour with JWDBfishes daughter on the back but any idiot can do that. Clip-ons are wrist murder when you are just bored cruising.

Id be doing a BMW K bike or a smaller 800 class touring, as fast as the sportbikes on the road for anything that makes sense and considerably more comfortable for slab riding.
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And you're not sore after riding several hours.

A few hundred bucks and it is a tossable bike.
That's why I got a Street Triple. All the fun of a sport bike, none of the discomfort. having an actual handlebar is the greatest. I've ridden my bike all over the country, and its only real downside is that it's small so you can't store much on it when travelling.

The Daytona (though known to be a really uncomfortable bike, in general) was murder to ride for over 30 min. to an hour in town. Absolutely miserable riding position for going 45 down a pin straight road in traffic.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 09:25 AM   #16
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Cant you get panniers for a Street Triple? The Guzzi isnt built for touring but Ive done 1300 mile weekend camping excursions on it with some Hepco and Becker bags and a bunch of shit in a dry bag strapped to the pillion.

Actually, speaking of bars, on any public roads a fast bike with bars, like a Aprillia Tuono, will be faster than its clip-on counterpart such as the RSV4. On roads you actually steer 90% of the time, bars provide more leverage for that. On a sportbike you rarely steer and are more counter-steering into a lean and then just using the throttle to control how much you fall into the corner, which isn't easy to do at safe-for-roads speed. Look at the GP circuits, long straights with a handful of tight corners, not a snaking mountain road.

As a result I have chased R1s up blood mountain on the Griso. On a road without straights that power doesn't make up for the speed you lost trying to go side to side.

Edit: Yep. Here you go. http://www.motomachines.com/Hepco-Be...13_p_3260.html

Those mounts take their line of bags and you can get semi-soft luggage that expands and can carry a shit-ton. Then just get bungees that hook around the mounts themselves to hold a 60l dry bag across the back seat. I spent 4 days blasting up and then down the entire blue ridge parkway, 1300 miles, with nary and issue (that was at the end of the trip so that dry bag is half full, but it was originally draped OVER the side bags).

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Unread 2015-10-20, 10:37 AM   #17
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Cant you get panniers for a Street Triple? The Guzzi isnt built for touring but Ive done 1300 mile weekend camping excursions on it with some Hepco and Becker bags and a bunch of shit in a dry bag strapped to the pillion.

Actually, speaking of bars, on any public roads a fast bike with bars, like a Aprillia Tuono, will be faster than its clip-on counterpart such as the RSV4. On roads you actually steer 90% of the time, bars provide more leverage for that. On a sportbike you rarely steer and are more counter-steering into a lean and then just using the throttle to control how much you fall into the corner, which isn't easy to do at safe-for-roads speed. Look at the GP circuits, long straights with a handful of tight corners, not a snaking mountain road.

As a result I have chased R1s up blood mountain on the Griso. On a road without straights that power doesn't make up for the speed you lost trying to go side to side.

Edit: Yep. Here you go. http://www.motomachines.com/Hepco-Be...13_p_3260.html

Those mounts take their line of bags and you can get semi-soft luggage that expands and can carry a shit-ton. Then just get bungees that hook around the mounts themselves to hold a 60l dry bag across the back seat. I spent 4 days blasting up and then down the entire blue ridge parkway, 1300 miles, with nary and issue (that was at the end of the trip so that dry bag is half full, but it was originally draped OVER the side bags).

A lot of super sports have trouble keeping up with me on tight, technical corners (like out by Lone Star Lake). When you are riding at sane speeds on public roads, clip ons don't do you any good, they only wear your wrists and shoulders out.

I can get bags on the back of my bike; I have tried two different types of (soft) bags, but they don't sit very stably because of my rear subframe and rear seat setup. I have to put a bunch of bungies on them to keep them still

I can try and dig up a picture of me and my buddy's bikes all loaded down when we went out to Deal's Gap... It's pretty hilarious how much stuff we got just on the passenger seats and tanks of our Streetys.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 10:41 AM   #18
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I dont get sportbike ownership in Kansas. Maybe a monster or another quick naked but I wouldn't own the MV if I lived in Kansas, just the Guzzi. Straight roads are the boringest as fuck when folded up on an uncomfortable superbike. Yeah you can go eleventy million miles an hour with JWDBfishes daughter on the back but any idiot can do that. Clip-ons are wrist murder when you are just bored cruising.

Id be doing a BMW K bike or a smaller 800 class touring, as fast as the sportbikes on the road for anything that makes sense and considerably more comfortable for slab riding.
I'm not in KS, theres lots of corners here too, I forgot that didnt go without saying
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Unread 2015-10-20, 10:56 AM   #19
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I would love to get a vmax sometime - it may look more like a cruiser, but they haul ass. Out of the original listed, I would get the buell, but I am bias. I do think you can find very nice examples cheap though.
I'm kinda surprised no one else has had any love for the Buell, I'm not a huge Harley fan, but I thought the oddball-ness was kind of charming
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Unread 2015-10-20, 12:44 PM   #20
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I'm not in KS, theres lots of corners here too, I forgot that didnt go without saying
No, there really arent. About the only thing worth a shit is well south of Springfield, towards the White Springs area. There might be some tiny back roads but nothing that actually counts as an actual twisty road, maybe a corner or two. And South MO still has nothing on even a decent mountain road.

But even if it did, youd be better off on a sport-naked or a standard. Bars are more agile at realistic speeds.

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I'm kinda surprised no one else has had any love for the Buell, I'm not a huge Harley fan, but I thought the oddball-ness was kind of charming
The reason people don't recommend them is that is the ONLY thing they have going for them. If youre a fan, dont mind sourcing parts for a frankenbike and do your own wrenching then go ahead. But dont go down, those twin-spar frames total easily compared to a trellis frame. Trellis frames are easier to repair too. There were a lot of reasons that Buell and then EBR failed, and Harley wasnt really any of them.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 12:49 PM   #21
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No, there really arent. About the only thing worth a shit is well south of Springfield, towards the White Springs area. There might be some tiny back roads but nothing that actually counts as an actual twisty road, maybe a corner or two. And South MO still has nothing on even a decent mountain road.

But even if it did, youd be better off on a sport-naked or a standard. Bars are more agile at realistic speeds.


Arkansas does have some of the best roads I have ever ridden, though. Very comparable to the Smokey Mountains, IMO.

Around Sedalia and central MO, there are roads with sweepers and curves, but you have to be going pretty damned fast, WAY above the speed limit, to have any fun on them.
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Unread 2015-10-20, 12:56 PM   #22
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Arkansas does have some of the best roads I have ever ridden, though. Very comparable to the Smokey Mountains, IMO.

Around Sedalia and central MO, there are roads with sweepers and curves, but you have to be going pretty damned fast, WAY above the speed limit, to have any fun on them.
And that is why the MV is for the track.

If you think Arkansas and the Smokeys are good you need to get your ass down here for a weeklong riding excursion (We should be able to rent a bike). Ill start you by going up Blood Mountain, my favorite road in the country, then we can go up a gap and piss a bit of time away on the Dragon (its overrated now) before doubling back to get on the Blue Ridge Parkway for a road that doesn't end till West Virginia. Then, if you still have anything left in you we can make our way over to the Cherohala, a beautiful B road that basically runs mountaintop to mountaintop, some of the best views in the southeast.

Blood Mountain/Suches
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bl...dddf86!5m1!1e4

And the Cherohala:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bl...dddf86!5m1!1e4
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Unread 2015-10-20, 01:07 PM   #23
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And that is why the MV is for the track.

If you think Arkansas and the Smokeys are good you need to get your ass down here for a weeklong riding excursion (We should be able to rent a bike). Ill start you by going up Blood Mountain, my favorite road in the country, then we can go up a gap and piss a bit of time away on the Dragon (its overrated now) before doubling back to get on the Blue Ridge Parkway for a road that doesn't end till West Virginia. Then, if you still have anything left in you we can make our way over to the Cherohala, a beautiful B road that basically runs mountaintop to mountaintop, some of the best views in the southeast.

Blood Mountain/Suches
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bl...dddf86!5m1!1e4

And the Cherohala:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bl...dddf86!5m1!1e4
I hit the Dragon in very early April last year, and it was pretty wide open.. REALLY cool road when it's not full of traffic. It's pretty scary when it's busy, though.

I have been meaning to head back out to the east coast for a while, now. I have a good friend in DC that I planned on seeing. Maybe I'll just ride my bike out there, visit him for a few days, and then make my way down south to check out some of these roads you're talking about.

EDIT: just clicked those links.. good lord, those look like some good roads
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Unread 2015-10-20, 01:13 PM   #24
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If you do then definitely do the BRP, even if I cant join I can point you to some incredible motorcycle campgrounds (with cabins as well).
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Unread 2015-10-20, 01:15 PM   #25
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We're getting off into hypotheticals here anyway. All the bikes I listed aren't something I'm specifically after, they're bikes for sale right now that are close and have a good price. Something more optimal can be had any time later on after I get some more ride time and want something newer.

Also, there's a CBR900RR that popped up last night that also sparks my interest.

Going to run some different options by my insurance agent today before work.
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